Best Made Weddings®
PODCAST TRANSCRIPTIONS - PART 2

*Please forgive any spelling or typographical errors. Episodes listed in the order they were recorded.

Episode 38 (“Drafting the Perfect Wedding Reception Playlist)

Well, if the pre recording banter is any indication, this is going to be a lively podcast today. We have, this is going to be a fun one. I tried to put together a round table about tipping and etiquette and leaving reviews and things. And no one seemed very interested. So we are building the perfect wedding playlist today. We have three wonderful wedding DJs, and then I'm going to be participating as number four. We have Alan Chitlin with Puget sound DJ. We have Greg Lauder with the fairs to remember. DJ entertainment. And then we have David Schwartz with a Ryan entertainment. Who's is joining us, Alan and Greg and I bicker back and forth for a good couple of hours about this. So. We're all kind of on the same page. Right? I wanted to use a list. I w I have am. At my disposal, which I'm going to use the top 200 requested songs. Per whatever Greg sent over some fancy DJ service, but DJ event planner. The event planner, but basically. Let's let everyone say hi, and then we'll say what's going on Allen. Say hi. Well, hello. I'm Alan from Puget sound DJ. Greg. I'm Greg louder affairs to remember entertainment. And I'm David Schwartz. I've arrived. Entertainment coming at you live in some point in time from the good vibes studio. Yeah. The David's also a fellow podcaster, which is exciting as well. This'll be fun. Allen's normally a little more buttoned up. So I think today we'll really let him get loose and goosey with, with pics. What we're doing, we're going to have, we're going to build the perfect wedding playlist. So imagine, you know, we're back at weddings now they're opening up. We're getting back to full dancing. You know, you do your first dance and your mother's son or whatever. Father daughter open dancing starts. Boom. These are the next, and we're going to do a draft around. We're going to do 10 songs, a piece. Hopefully if it takes forever, what, maybe we'll cut it down. But there we go. So everyone knows the premise. Alan didn't want to use the list. I'm going to use the list and we're going to see how we're going to go. Can we drew for numbers. And we drew for numbers and I'm going to put the I'm going to put the Google doc. In the podcast. So you can see everybody's list and whatever, and you can follow along. My I am number one in the draft and my pit coming in hot and fresh is number one in the most requested. Ready list Whitney Houston. I wanna dance with somebody it's everybody on the dance floor. Gets eaten. It gets moms. Dads gets grandmas grandpas. Everyone comes around in little kids. You can't beat that. The energy. And everything that's involved with that. So any, any thoughts on my pick for the number one, that dance song? We wouldn't have thought that you would have picked anything different. I mean, it's the number one dancer on for a reason. Like it. It really legitimately still gets everybody out there. I don't think people think it's overblown. The only challenge for me with that song is that it's four minutes and 37 seconds or something. So having a. As a DJ standpoint, having a shorter version or fading out earlier is good. That's good feedback. All right. I think that's an excellent choice for first number one, dance requests song. Absolutely. I think four minutes is only giving Whitney the justice. She deserves. So if anyone has a problem with that, I think they can go grab a drink and come back when they have, you know, Figured that out. So it's a banger. It never fails. It never fails to get everybody. I guess I like it. Cause it's all ages. Right? Cause at that point let's get as many people as we can out there. And then, and then we'll move from there. So David is number two, correct. Did I get that right? I think I'm number three. I was going to say, what is it like? What's like a one 20 situation. Isn't it? Right. I mean, you can easily toss some like. You're on this, under that and makes it into something housey. You can kind of do a lot with it too. So I think that's a great choice for like first song of your dance that too. And Reed. I appreciate you trying to cheat me out of the number two pick, but I am not going to accept it. I am going to make this pick all. Regardless of whether you think David or Greg or someone else should. All right, let's see. What's, Allen's pick big number one. A song that I just want to have in my arsenal. Is what maybe I would consider to be the last universal hit. Music is getting so fragmented that this is the last song that I can think of, that everybody knows everybody can sing too, and everybody can dance. And if you think I'm going on too long about this, just tell me to shut up. And I will shut up and I will dance. Ah, I see what you did there. There you go. Yes. So, you know, Alan, you don't have to take the full five minutes to make your pick on this draft. It's the first round. Greg, what song is it? Shut up. And Dan. Like walk the moon. Yeah. How did you not catch that? That was well-crafted. I thought it was that I felt that he said like, okay, that's fine. Shut up and dance walk the moon. I always thought that it was like offensive. The title. You don't think that's offensive. No. Shut up and dance. I would say my library, that's a lot more offensive than that. From a versatility standpoint, it is a great last ant song as well. Yeah. No. Well, technically you don't want them to end the night by. Shutting up and dancing, but I hear you. Great peg Allen. That one does always hit. I'm going to give it. My, my standby, my number one, my heart and soul earth, wind and fire. Steptember. Do you remember. Is nine less. Amazing. W what year did that song come out? That's not good. It's it's 79, right? Yeah. Late. Sixties, early seventies. It's never gotten old ever in the history. It was mid to late seven. Okay. Isn't that crazy. Like the lasting power of earth, wind and fire. Well, for me that has like a, a strong connection to my parents too, because I mean, my mom had that earth, wind and fire CD rocking in the car, you know, all the time. So I think it translates to other people too. I mean, That whole album let's groove. Buggy Wonderland. Let's go. Late late 78 is when it came out. Yeah. Hi, Greg that's team. All right. I just got a call from Alan privately and he wanted to trade his next four picks for my fourth pick, but I turned him down. Okay. So I'm going to go ahead and. Make my pick. I'm going to skip ahead a little bit, but in, in the night, but I'm going to get a usher. Yeah. Oh, sure. Yeah. I disagree on this. If I play. Yeah. I get like three people to look at me and go really. Why. Yeah, because, cause it's like a general thing is if, if I can get grandma dancing at the end of the night to usher. Yeah. I've won the night. I think you're right there. If you play it at the end of the night, you'll have better luck with that than if you played it. I'm not going in order here. I'm getting it now so I'm can use it later. Very good. I'm just adding Scott. We were, I thought we were doing it in the order that we're doing it. No, we have to reset these cause these aren't in a particularly great order on here. No, I thought you were picking the song. It's like you were building the playlist so that. That's your first song, right? Am I wrong in this? Yeah. Oh, this is just, I thought it was more interesting. Picking the best 10 songs we can get now because, and then we'll cram. Put them in order. That's where our skill and ability comes from. Wow. Okay. Can't do it real time. Okay. All right. All right. I don't agree with it. I really. I agree with any of the rules on the fog house at all. Well, I'm I'm Ford. Okay. So, okay, so we're picking. Okay. All right. All right. I might need a second now. I'm flustered. Interesting song. You can always, you know, make up at the end of the night. You're your last pick? All right, I'm going to go with a, what is it? Number 11 on the top 200 songs. I'm going to go, ah, I can't justify picking uptown funk with as many times as I've heard that song in my life, but it is a new uptown funk and can't fight this feeling. By a Justin Timberlake. I think that that, that still slaps now and, and is, is almost just as popular and Dorothy didn't even know that that was Justin Timberlake. She goes like, hi. No idea. So there you go. Any thoughts about can't stop the feeling. Nothing like a troll song. I think if I. Uptown funk as well. If I were to sort every song in my library by times played. That's my number one, number one. I played that in the most of anything. There you go. Number. Yeah. Number that was number 11 on the top 200 requested songs. Number two is uptown funk. That's still up for grabs. Well, you're, you're, you're spoiling the surprise of my pick a little bit, but I still think uptown funk. Does it, one of the great things is that it is contemporary, but you can also play it early. Right. And so it, it can help set a mood where maybe you're playing some oldies at the beginning, but you can drop in uptown funk as a nod to the younger people to say, I got your back. We're going to, we're going to keep it contemporary. So that's, that's my number two. It is, it does have that old time. I made it. It's a very modern song, basically. It's kind of got that. I get what you're saying. It's got a timeless sound. I think that's all. I was going to be around for a very long time. Also, it's got just this iconic intro and it hits everyone in the face. You hit that riser into that. This hit. I's called and everyone stops and, and hits the dance floor. Now that's not going to be around a lot. Around around for a very long time. I agree, Greg, I think on your, I get to know your wedding pro parents. I think we talked about songs like that and like why uptown funk is still like, what it, I didn't even. What is it about that song that makes it, it's like literally the most timeless. Play the billion times. It never gets old. Yeah, it's got a weird combination of, of, of R and B funk, Motown, big band. I mean, really, if it's got a lot of in the mood, sort of feels which in the mood was, this was the same song 20 years ago. And even though that songs from the forties and, and stuff, but it had that when big band and swing came back. I am Frank and Ella and Billy. And while those were so huge that led to people doing ballroom dancing and speak, you know, swinging and that sort of stuff. And this has that kind of, I mean, if you've ever seen him in concert, I mean, it's, it's, it's a full band, it's an orchestra really? And he controls them like an orchestra. What have so humble brag. Have you seen Bruno in concert? I haven't actually. He's on my list. You're like, well, you know, I've watched some videos. No, I, he, he's on my very few artists that are out now that I haven't seen. He'd be definitely at the top of the list. He does that with a lot of his music too. And he's done that really well. I think combining the different decades and bringing them into a new age. And kind of reminds me of prince a little bit. The integrity of it. Yeah. I think I, as a Seahawks fan, I banked the Seahawk. Broncos super bowl. Right? Cause that was when he did his big halftime performance. That to me was when he went to like the other echelon of, of, and I remember we were covering that down that. The weather. What's the casino in Tacoma, the Tulalip. I'll go shoot Michael. Well, Michael shoots in Auburn, the one Emerald queen. We covered. They have like 10,000 people watching the super bowl there and yeah. Anyway. All right. David's up number three. All right, I'm going to, I'm going to take this on before anyone else does, because some of us aren't working off of a list. You know, we're working off of our actual experience. But the number one song I tell you right now from this day forward. And it's going to be around for awhile is dually buzz. Levitating. Old. Good one. I don't know, hard. I played a prom last weekend. It was a bit of a unique situation. They like split them into five groups. And they had different groups come in for COVID reasons. Right. Wow. I did play levitating four out of five times. So there you go. Wow. And, and are you down on that blessing Madonna remix or do you like the original. My God, I have not heard it. Oh my God. I know what you're doing when this. With the baby. The debate, the remix is the one you have to play. Cause that's actually the iconic bit of it too. Which is funny because like on bar bangers and stuff, you have to like specifically find that one, but the one that's on the radio. Is the debate, the version. And that's really the fun bit to sing along to. I don't think I know this song at all. I haven't been. No way with dancing while the house. I do know the baby though. He was on that. He was on SNL and was talking about how he made millions. Right. I made millions by myself or something. Yeah, I think you're right. I only had the baby fan through dual Libra. Dave is a good rapper. Greg's up with number a number four here. I am up with number four. I am ill prepared for my number four. Pick. I know the one. Well, you know, I'm just going to do my I'm going to. I'm going to go and take a journey. Don't stop believing again for the end of the night. That's a good one. And yes, read. I have seen them in concert. Okay, but you are older. Actually, it was fairly recently. But, yeah, so it was kind of fake. Oh, when I was a kid by my neighbor. It was a couple of years older than me. And I remember the night she went and saw Def Leppard open for journey in the eighties. And I remember. Just being like, what? I mean, like what a show? I. I was too young to go, but I remember like that would have been just a crazy cool show to go see and in the eighties, so. Stuck with me for a long time. As a good one. It always gets people singing at the end of the night. So. Yeah. I, I like that. I guess this is in my pick now speaking, I guess I'll take, I guess, cause we're not going in order. I guess we'll just one that I would like to have at my repertoire is, is similar to that in terms of singalong ability. I did actually cover this gentleman in concert. When he played in Bakersfield, California, I shot, we got to shoot like the first two minutes of, you know, when they come out and do it. Neil diamond and a sweet Caroline. I will take that on, on my last. I like that one a lot. Excellent. And so, yes, I saw him in concert for five minutes and it was like about an hour. Then I followed him to get set up to cover that, but that was, I got about two minutes and then I had to walk out. What did he open with? Coming to America or whatever. Right. Yeah. So, anyway, that was good. No. No fast on that, that one that kind of went over like a fart. I mean, so it was like for my fraternity, it was our like initiation song. So when somebody else signed. Like to the house, we would all sing it. So I have a lot of positive. Associations with it, but I think that's honestly, I almost never played at a wedding and I think that's the reason why. Unless I was like playing for one of my fraternity brothers. I wouldn't do it. I don't know why. That's just one. Do you play it? I sure do. I like it as a song also near the end. Like I was talking about shut up and dance where everybody just kind of comes together and as a community feeling. So, yeah, that's a great pit. Thank you. Greg is checking his notes and crossing it off. Sweet Carolina. This is a draft. I didn't have to go to the second page for that one read. There's a reason it's at the top. So. Good. Good. Good. All right. Allen's app number two. I always forget. All right. So I'm going to go with an oldie that still feels like a throwback. I think, to a lot of people. The Backstreet boys, everybody. Oh, that is not where I thought you would go with that. I wanted it. So I reached in the third round. I would have thought I wanted it that way. I, that would have been my Backstreet boys. It's so good. And they play that at the Mariners a lot. So the 15 people that go to Mariner games really enjoy. Enjoy that song too. I couldn't tell you the last time I heard everybody. That's that's literally an hour ago at the grocery store. And I was literally singing in the hallways. I play everybody incentive. I want it that way. Oh, there you go. Yeah. No, you have a nineties babies crowd and you're going to play like three Backstreet boys songs. You put, I want it that way in there. Absolutely. Yeah. Probably first. I do love that. Yeah. I'm at the age now where a lot of the people like are my age or a little bit younger are getting married and yeah, it's a lot of songs. Like I know now, like, you know, these like. I when you get like blink one 82 plane, right. When it's like all this smell. I'm like women. When would that ever have been like a song that was played at the wedding reception, but that's a good, yeah. David's number three. Oh, okay. Well then speaking of the nineties, wow. It could be. Oh, I can be wrong on that one, but it might be an early two thousands. And I'm going to take it before anyone else does it because it is one of my favorite bangers to play. Of all time and it goes out to you. The killers, Mr. Brightside. I saw the killers in Spokane Washington at the big, easy. They were not. I don't even think I that's all, I, he just hit whatever. The first one, that one is, is, seems to cross the age barrier. I have to admit. Or the young, I think it's definitely a younger thing and that maybe it has something to do with tic-tac. Social media. I'm not exactly sure, but the younger generation knows that song and loves that song. Yeah. So even like, you know, gen Z. Yeah. Sad song. Do the killers still make music? I think so. I think. Yeah, I dunno. That was not on Greg streph board. Ah, man, I liked the song, but, but I can count on one hand how many times I played her. It's just me. I'm gonna go with black IPS. I got a feeling and I always play a. A remix of that one that. That is a little bit faster and a little bit more consistent. You can't remember which one it is right now. But anyway, that one. It's kind of was a uptown funk before uptown funk was there. You know, what is about four years before uptown funk came out? It has that universal appeal. People love to yell. Mazal Tov. You know, I mean it's it's, it's it's clad. The bar mitzvah banger for me. Aye. Damn the black IPS, I, all their songs are just so. And that song, it just it's the same thing for four minutes. I mean, they just it's like, I got that feeling. I got to feel like I'm in the muscle's house fun, but. I don't know, I can't stand the black guy piece. I grew up when they were on like TRL every day, you know, they were in the top 10. How about you can't tell me that you don't like where's the love that song is eternal. That's all right. But that's the man is also a banger, but I wouldn't put it on this list, but pump is a phenomenal song. That's a good one. You could probably make that out of Mr. Brightside, too. Well, I think my humps will still be there for your next payment. I'm going to go with one that I find David was going to pack and that when he was talking about like the late nineties or whatever, I'm in the guy, and this is a banger too, that gets everyone thinking. Miley Cyrus party in the USA. I have asked her, you are gone. Like early two thousands. Huh. Well, but no, no, no. She's a, that was like early two thousands, like 2005. Are they in the USA? That is 2000 and like five or 13. Does it not have the. Partly, well, no, it's got the remake. Wow. Only nine. I am older. Anyway, that is where I'm going to go. You get a lot of that really has made a resurgence in the age group that I am out now filming and, and the couples that are my weddings. So well that's because they were in high school. When that song came out. Yep. That's a good one. And there's some really good. Not totally weirded out, but, but good. Extra remixes of it, where they still keep relatively the same tempo, but you know, every time she shouts out an artist, they play a little bit of that. Artist's music. There's a couple of good ones like that. Watch out for Miley Cyrus's latest album too. It hit very, very, very well with my age group. It's great for, if somebody kind of wants an alternative cocktail hour, you can definitely throw a few in there. Her new album is actually amazing. She was on SNL and was phenomenal, like really only getting better. Like she was singing it. Sharon. She was really good. I was like, this is not very, it's crazy. Crazy the evolution. She I, yeah. And she's, she's, she's going to be around. I think she'll be one of those iconic artists that are here forever. For my generation, at least. Mr. Brightside was number 14 on the requested list. So I guess I, that kinda, that, that shook me, but I guess that's good. Allen, here we go. Well read. Tell me, tell me what you want. What you, what you really, really want. Yeah, cause I'm going to have the spice girls. I'm going to have them now and I'm going to play him and people are going to rock out that they're going want to be. Is the name. Yeah, that's a good one. I know that one. I. That that, that like, And that was almost like an ironic song and now has really become like, it hits it weddings. Right. Or was it never ironic? It's a little novelty for a while, but it was, I mean, it was popular the first time around also, but it. You was really there only. I only had a couple other ones that were danceable, but they all kind of seem to come out in a big burst in there. It's funny. My first association with that song, I think is a McDonald's commercial. And now it was like the first time I heard it. And I don't know if that is the reason why. But it's possible. If that's the reason why you like it or you don't like it. I know I love that song. It's just got such a great hook. And it's instant. Right? I love those kinds of things. Yeah. And want to be that's the name of the song, right? Yep. It was like all one, right? I want to be like, it's all one. Like when it just dives right in, and it's instantly recognizable, but then kind of keeps that energy throughout. There's some really good. I feel we're going to have to go through some of these that we didn't pick at the end. Some good songs on this list. Greg a year. I mean, David's up. Thank you, David. Sorry. My thing was. Give this one to one of my favorite songs that I didn't appreciate fully until I became a wedding DJ. And it goes out to it's raining men. Yeah. And it's a great way to get the. Girls on the dance floor. You can play a whole lot on. Kind of. You know, female empowerment songs after that. Yep. Pointer sisters. Once they singing and they beat starts, or do you get the long drawn out? It depends. If I think I actually have enough older folks who will recognize it because otherwise if it's a young group and probably straights. Came straight to the chorus or something like that, because he'll be like, what is this song? What. And then they'll leave the second. They start to figure it out. They turn right back around. Chancellor. I liked that one. I think that's a good, I think that's a good choice. I always remember. I love actually with you grant when he's like dancing to that in the. He's the prime minister or whatever. I always think that that's funny. Alright, Greg, let's go for it. I take outcast. Hey. Yeah. I was. I almost didn't take that one out at protests because it is the most depressing wedding salon that's ever been known to, man. I'm with you. What you don't like shaking it. It's a very depressing song. You just either. I'm I'm moving on, picking the next song. So I'm not overly listening to there's no swear words in it. So I'm not. Freaking out about the lyrics. That is number 22 on the list. Alan. Thoughts on, Hey, ya. Still works for me. I think so. Yeah. Good pick Rick. Thanks Helen. You're welcome. I'm going to go with with the one. This is another one that I was like, maybe we got a lull in the night. Everyone's getting their drinks. Right. You're getting some beer and you hear this song. You come running back. Kenny Loggins, Footloose. With a bullet. It gets everywhere. It doesn't matter what you're doing. You're going to the bathroom. I got to go back and dance to this song before I go. Do anything else? I think that's a great pick and it's also a great song to play kind of early. Like, because it is somewhat universal. All the generations know it. Like if I'm playing Footloose in a night is within my first 10 songs for sure. Yeah, it's now considered an oldie. It's not an old dude. All right. I was going to make an age joke earlier when someone was talking like, oh, that was what was playing when I was in high school and I was going to be, oh, you mean with like sticks and rocks? But I didn't, I didn't, I didn't make the joke out. I think they call you out though. I will know. I. Have the pockets now. Ah, okay. It's David, sir. No. Okay. I wasn't even trying. I wasn't even like zoom blocks half the Google doc. So that's why I keep messing up. I wrote it down on a piece of paper reading. It works really well. That's good. I have to show I'm typing real time as we pick these songs. All right. Well, as you may know, my initials are AC. And there's only one classic rock band that has accepted those. And I just want you to shake me all night long. With the ACDC classic. Like I just feel like there's four or five classic rock songs that. Still just crush it every time, but you shook me all night long. In the right at the right time. We'll we'll bring them out. Yep. That's a good one. Yeah, it's hard. It's a hard song though. I mean, it's like pretty, you know, The guitar is pretty iconic too. So you can layer that under something and people are gonna recognize it pretty quick. Yeah. It. You can't count last year, but, but I probably, it's probably my most played song still, but I saw dropping off a little bit in 2019 where it was just not that as much and it's too bad because it was one of those. You could throw it in and it just about any point of the night and you like it, and people that are into it are really into it. It doesn't seem like one of those. Casual, but I think part of it it's gone the way of, of where rock has gone, which it's like. It's just not that much rock left. So. Number 28 on the list. It is. And also everybody Backstreet boys was number 18. Very surprised. I did not realize that would be so high, so that's good. Alan goes. I mean, that proves, you know, you guys know what's being requested. Without shook me all night long, probably has, is still has the number one on this list. The more, most than any other song. It's been a number of years, but I bet you for 15 out of 25 years or 20, it's been the number one song. Also, it is a really dirty song. Right back. I can remember hearing it at almost every private event I went to growing up. When I was doing bar mitzvahs. Like going to them. I mean, we all knew that song cause it got played every week. And we loved it. It caught all of us on the dance floor. I don't know if it would be as successful with the current generation. But I think it's still got a few, it's just a Tik TOK video away from being popular again. Big fact right there. All right, David, you're up. Okay. Well, I can't believe anyone hasn't taken this so far. But I got to give it to dancing queen. I did was I have, I volun that number 12, I was eyeball on that. I have never played that song to an empty dance floor. It has never happened in the history of the world. We were watching. We started watching that mama Mia the other night. Very, very fun movie. So that. Getting back into the office stuff. No for right now. What's that. Speaking of tech talk as super trooper is about to be a big one for that very reason you just watch. There's a viral tic-tac going on right now and talking about how a super trooper is a banger. And honestly, Alan. How is your tic-tac team game going right now? Oh, well, I'm. You know, David and I being of the same generation, you know, we're in constant contact. About how Tik TOK is going for us. So. That's great. There's that. Max song with the guy on the. On the skirt. On the skateboard. Gypsy. Yeah, that's a good one. Yeah. That's a great one. Oh, there you go. Greg you're up. I am up and I am going to take. I like it by Cardi B. Nice. Unexpected Greg. I would think that would come out of you. Which one is that? Number 41. I gave her like that, but like, it's a roommate. Yeah, well kind of, I actually have, I made a little remix to myself that extends out the original song and. I had a wedding. One of them last year, that just one of the original. And so I was playing around with it and it's. It makes it a little, if Scott. You know, it's got those aspects who covers the Latin and covers the. Big band and swing. It covers. Modern rap. And you could almost. It might be a nice little bridge from the old to the new somewhere in, in the end of your first, you know, set sort of thing, 20 minutes in half an hour in. So. And it's you can't ignore it. It's a good song. Yeah. A bad landing. Yeah. Yeah, I headlined WrestleMania this year. It wasn't a tech team match. He was like the co headliner. Tremendous match. I mean, he really worked his, it worked his tail off to, to do that. So. I think they won the tech huddles. So it was a very exciting year for bad bunny. I am going to go with, and I did not see this gentleman in concert. He played at the wedding MBA a couple of years ago when that, when those were in the in-person thing in Vegas, and a lot of the wedding vendors went to that. Which makes sense. Cause this is a highly rated wedding song. Montell Jordan. This is how we do it. Yep. Is that a good, that seems like it got a good knot. No, I was, I was actually remembering. Yeah. Did you go to that? Were you there? Yeah. I, I think my, I think my friend was in Vegas too at the time, and I think we went out with this as opposed to going to that. Thank you. Very fun show. I have a love, hate relationship with this song. I actually like it. But I. So to me, When you watch and read, we talked about this. On on my podcast is, is a lot of what you're looking at. The dance floor is your it's a running, you know, math equation plus minus sort of stuff. And this song. I think I even talked about it in, on that particular podcast is it never works for me. I've tried it at the beginning. I've tried at the end. I've tried to out of a, slow into a slow I've tried different versions and I bet you. Say the 50 times I've played it or more it's it's bombed like lost multiple amounts of people. 47 Out of 50 times. Enough to the point where I, unless it's just a must playlist, I don't even play it anymore. So. But it's not that. Huh. I was gonna say, I don't play it a lot either. I love the intro. You know, it's got that, all the stuff we talked about, other songs where you instantly recognizable it's there. It's kind of cool. I dunno why. So. But I like to listen to it. So. Allen your turn. I do not know. What genes have apple bottoms. However, I do know that I want to play low by a fluoride when the time is right. I love these intros. You're very Mar Becca of you. I have to say. Thank you. I think there are some songs like yeah. And low. That are. Feel raunchy, but are socially acceptable. Right. And so, as you're trying to sort of signal, we're getting. We're getting more. PG they're temporary or we're ratcheting it up a little bit. Those are some songs that I think can do that, but not go all the way and a shots or something like that. Jots. Yep. Yep. I, I will tell a story here. I, Flo rider opened the second annual pit bull cruise out of Miami, and I was. About this many vodka sodas and. When he took the stage and it was a tremendous show and he was carried out into the crowd by his 400 pound body guard. And I was touching his back. It was a very, it was a very fun. Very fun time. So I'm a big fan of flow rider and then seeing them multiple times. So it's a good time. Well, it's all downhill for the rest of this podcast. Now that that story has been heard. That was a tremendous night. That was a tremendous night. We took a nap and then saw a pit bull. At 10 o'clock. So that was so it's a long, and that was a long day. Do you still have a lock of pit bulls hair? I have a signed poster on my wall and I also still have my wristbands on, so I'll never forget. We're talking about flow rhino or Pitbull. Florida opened. For the PayPal concert. I see. Also says, when does pit bull have hair? That was the judge. There you go. All right. Thank you, Chad. I was following along. It was the last hair that he had. You ever saw that Sarah. All right, David, let's go. All right. Well, first of all, you guys have been dropping some bombs out here and I am now I've written down like six to choose from, and I can't even decide. So I'm gonna, I'm gonna take an unexpected tack here. I'm going to give it out to my country, weddings. And I'm going to say friends in low places. That's high here on the list too. I saw that that was a, that's a pretty good, that's a pretty good pick. I wish you view a studio version with the third verse. You know, I'm trying to play the long version. Right. Yeah, it's the only one I got. It's the only one you want. Yeah. I mean, that's a nice, like five minutes singalong that gets every word. I play the one that just kind of fades out at the end. We've done it for 10 it's. Number 10 on the requested list. You know what I'm talking about? The third verse. So no. Oh, so in concert, I just, for you read, I've seen Garth three times. And. He, the third verse talks about, you know, Because at the end of the second one, he leaves basically. And the third one it's like something like. Something something. And I turned around and I don't know, there's a first, he says, kick your ass or something to this effect. I'm not going to get the lyrics. Right. But he only does in concert. He has never done it in the studio. And so you can't because there's so much sing along. It's really tough to play. But, but it's one that people know it and they kind of expect it. And it's just kind of a funny term plus. Here in Garth Brooks say ass is kind of always amusing. So. But. In concert it's. It's the highlight. So. Oh, there you go. Nevermind. It's a. That my, my flat. That's a good, no, I like that. I think that's a wonderful tip, but I enjoyed that. I was going to say thank you for sharing that. I think that's you're welcome. Thank you. I'm up next. I will take. I am going to take get low by little John. Oh, You don't lay it out at weddings a lot. And that cracks me up because that song was. Huge when I was in middle school. Like. And I'll play it, but I'm always like, all right. Like I know it'll work, but yeah. But. Build to it, fourth or fifth last song. Cause really, cause it's pretty low on the, on, on BPM. And then you can build from that. And again, it's like, yeah, if it works. It works really well. You're right. It's gotta be the right audience. I'm not, I will not play that at my wedding. In a month. With, with an older crowd. So that was the biggest song in the world for like the year or whatever that came. I mean, that was tremendously huge. Oh, and for the record I play the edited version of that song. Silent. Kind of edited. That's good. I like that. All right. I'm surprised this is still on the board. This is a big sing along song. I was going to make. Well anyway. Have any funny jokes for this one by that? A good sing along song. You get all the ages. A Bon Jovi living on their prayer is, is always, is always a good one for it too. To rattle, razzle the crowd up. I found the best. I mean the vast living on a prayer remix. I played it on my DJ sessions last two, three days ago now. Wow. I'll put it in the comments, like tell me what you think. It's like a hard house Remax. Like. Oh boy. I will get used at some point, I do a lot of like EDM weddings, too. No, I can't wait to put that kind of stuff out. That's interesting. I like. How does it start? Like that's my that's always my challenge with living on a prayer is that that intro is so iconic. But it's long. I can't even think of the insurer in my head right now. Right. Yeah. Well, okay, Alan, I you're up. All righty. So my next selection is sort of something I would play when I might play Footloose. Like within that first 10 songs, just to get people going. And it's by Dixie's midnight runner. Come on, Eileen. I just, it's a song that lots of people know, and it feels very inviting. So I want to have that in my toolkit. That's they're going. I think. Am I crazy, real big fish. I think that's a cover of that song. That's interesting. There's some Scott cover of that song. That's very good. Maybe it's maybe it's me first. And they gave me, gave me this, but that's a good one. Yeah. I liked that one a lot. Also feels like a dirty song is that non-attorney song. They're Australian aren't. They. I mean, I don't know. I always thought they were Irish. Got it. Maybe you're right. I don't know. David. I'm gonna look them up. You go. David, I'm going to look at the origin and Dixie in. They're right there. They're from Birmingham. Okay. There you go, huh? My next one, it goes to, if I have like a true, like a Motown crowd, and I know that they know their Motown. I'm going to throw in my absolute favorite. Song. Car wash. Oh, Oh, that is bad. Man. Cause if you can just get them with the claps. I bet. Oh, wait. Builds so nicely. And then people just lose their minds. It's amazing. Are you surrounding that with Motown? Are you surrounding that with disco? I would call a Motown. Is it, am I wrong? I could be wrong on that. I'm never going to say that decades or more. The heart of disco. Yeah, but they bled over with a lot of that stuff as they got out into the seventies, you know, Take Jackson five, for example, right. Probably 75% of their songs would be Motown, but then about 25% bled into the disco. And then Michael going. You know, solo and stuff. So. But. I think there's a, and now it's, that line has been, you know, blender even. Yeah. And, and what's, you know, like I, I had to learn that entire genre, if you will. Like the only, I mean, I did my first ever, what was, I guess, you know, funk, Motown. Our party and the request list. The client gave me at the time. This was years ago. And I was like, yeah, you know, it's not my strong suit, but like, if you give me the request, I will make it happen. I tell you, I fell in love. With that entire. Type of music. And I like the playlist was massive and that party, I will never forget that party. It was a 50th birthday party in her house. And all of these adults by the end of the night were. Drunk off there. Rockers and like, you know, I had done a sorority party the night before, and I literally got on the mic. I was like, guys, you guys are partying harder than all of the sorority girls did last night. Like they're all drunk on the table. Just screaming Katy Perry. It was. Amazing. No. Or phonics, but like, you know, I did my thing by the end of the night. Excellent. Greg you're up. You've been. Yeah, making notes there. I love him. Studious Greg looks. Yeah. I am. I am I'm, I'm planning my set a little bit. We're at the point now and much like fantasy football, where you have to fill out and think about who isn't going to be available for a buy or all that sort of stuff. So I don't have an opener. So my opener is going to be a brown girl. I have to go on. I was going to take that. That was a great song. I had a challenge one time. A bride wanted to dance with her too, with her dad. To that song for the father daughter dance. But the second verse is making love something about making love in the deep green grass. Which is not necessarily advisable lyrics for a father, daughter dance. And, and she wanted a slow version. And so I actually found some dude literally. Played it in his, in his living room on probably using garage band. Oh, with his guitar and left out that verse and sing it slow. And I emailed him and said, Hey, can I borrow that song? And he gave us permission and it was pretty awesome. So that's good. And you were also respectful of the artist and, and reached out. So that was good. Yeah. I mean. We had months to do it and she, and I just thought it would be the right thing to do. And, and, and the bride was kind of cool. She actually gave him a credit. In her wedding. Program. So I thought that was nice. All right, ma I'm up. I'm going to go a little more, a little more modern. This duo was the top of the world for about three years and then has, has less spinner. They have again. Th th this is a banger. L M F a O party rock Anthem. I want that in my life. Excellent. Speaking of Motown. Is there their dad, their dad, and grandpa's very Gordy. Yeah, very famous, right? Yeah. Yeah. That was, they were that in sexy, as I know it. Right. Or sexy. Right. Sexy. And I know. And then that was it. Then they broke up. Right. Well, their, their uncle and nephew. So were you guys, Alan, you were there. Did you guys go to mobile beat when they spoke? I was not at that one. Oh, okay. Just this. The funny thing is they were in on the joke. And so they live the life. They did it. And, you know, his, he talked about growing up with Diana Ross is his godmother and all this other stuff. And, but you're right. They did it. And then they broke up and kind of went their separate ways. But. You know, part of it is he was like, 18 Or 20 years older than his nephew. So, but great interview kind of funny guy and just. You know, he he's in on the joke. I don't know how else to do it, but you're right. Total bangers. That'll be a song that'll be around for a long time, too. All right, you got a very overplayed at the time, but I think now that with a little hindsight, I think it's better. Out Alan eardrum. Hey, you got the order right way to go read. All right. So like Greg, I'm trying to fill in my lineup a little bit. And now I'm thinking about the end of the night. I'm thinking about. Having some songs that I know will cause people to sweat. And local boy makes good with his partner. Ryan Lewis Macklemore will sing. Can't hold us. I literally can't think of one that's ever not, not succeeded. Yeah. Yellow's on. That is an excellent choice. Yep. No, no, not. Got it. Great. I'm video school too with him, like right. He's on like the pirate ship or something. They're all his videos are good. What happened is he. I just saw him here. He played the billboard music awards with that song, or I'm sorry, not billboard. He played the American idol finale on Sunday night. And they had all the people doing it. So they, they sang. You know, saying the nanos part. So yeah, he just. Oh, sorry. Sorry. You. I was going to say, whenever I play, can't stop the feeling. You know, when am I at one 60 at that 0.1 55 or something? I have always got. What that, how do I play now? Then the after, after can't stop the feeling at times, like where do I go? And I'll tell you, gentlemen. The answer is. Every time we touched by cascade. Yeah. There we go. That's a great one. It's the only one I've got that takes it. Just. A step above. And it gives them a nice break between the jumping. As you can like sing that chorus, get everybody together. Nice circle. It's that's a phenomenal song. We, I had a couple of, they did their first dance to that song and that was, it was phenomenal. An acoustic and then a. No, it was like this. That song that I can, they did, like, they have like a thing and they came out and they. Yeah, it was at that, that T palace or whatever down in rent in that holds, you know, a thousand people or whatever that they do that. Vietnamese way, but yeah, that was, that was, that was a crazy couple. They were in costume. It was like a whole thing. Didn't use the video at all. It's nowhere on the website. Good. Any other thoughts on that one? I love it. Oh, wait. It was my pick. Oh, it's a Greg spec. That was it. Okay. Whatever. Did you skip him? Oh, what'd you take last Allen? Okay. Can hold us. Yeah. And then David did every time we touch. And now it's your grade. Was that your actual pick or were you just saying that's what. Oh, It was a segue. I worship you. Oh, I literally, so. I'm going to take a shout. But I'm going to take the Isley version brothers rubber. Brother's version. Not this animal house or Dynatones or. Whatever else you want, but that's the version I would like. I like shout. It always gets everybody involved. Yup. It's number 65 on your list. Yeah, really. We're going to, we're going to roll through at the end here, and then we're gonna list some ones that weren't. Talking about order, like what were we supposed to like. I was just. Yeah, you're good. Yeah, we're good. We're good. You're good. Don't worry about. All right from my pick. I'm going to pick one Allen even played at my own wedding, but he deejayed. Th this was, that goes along with our, with our crews. Talk about pit bull. We're going to go with timber featuring Casha. That is, that is. A really good song. That's a really, there's no way around it. You got that. [Unknown]. I mean, that's a, that's a good one. So. I choose timber extracts the most dancing still. But I also, I love don't stop the party. And then fireball, I mean, pit bull. Pimples got some darn songs. Yeah. Yup. Yup. All right. For my ninth pick. I'm going to go with a song that I don't know how to pronounce. Ah, you're gonna, ah, yeah, I'm taking it dancing. You have to be honest, say ads. Ads Danza. I have to say it. I'll just play it brother. We also have that at our wedding. Again, it's a, it's a, it's a song that just is really consistent. It just. It works and yeah. David take notes. That's good. No, I was crossing it out. All right. Do you know how to pronounce it? You can correct me and talk. Well, you don't roll the R that much. No, I don't think it. K U D U R O. Okay. All right. Yeah, we did our, we did our grandad. So that played plays in many, a pool and in Mexico when Dorothy and I were dating. What is your ninth pick David? My ninth pick. Because nobody has even said a single one of her songs and she must, must, must be mentioned in any conversation. A modern wedding music. And it is a very, very tough choice between the two and I'm currently staring at, but I'm going to give it to truth hurts by Lizzo. Good as hell. I love good as hell. Drew thirds is the right fantastic song, but truth hurts. Nudges it out. Yeah, that's it. That is the correct choice of those two. So. She's is Liz. I. I mean, I guess this is still around. I mean, she's. All right. Around. I want you to watch the replay and look at, David's look on his face when you said. Everybody kind of took last year off. If you hadn't heard yet read. I wouldn't know that because. Every Friday, we have like new Kygo music, every, every single Friday, at least. But the Dorothy puts on and there's been a lot in a lot of these house DJs or whatever are still producing music. So, sorry. Sorry for that. Greg your last for number nine. Then we've got our final round here. I have not taken a disco song yet. So I'm going to take one of my all time family oriented songs and choose. We are family. How many do we have left? Last one. After this. Okay, 10. It always works. Yeah, I guess I, I mean, I like that, so I can picture in my head like a family, like putting their arms around each other thing. And I'm like, yeah, early on. I mean, I could come out of brown and girl with it if I wanted to. And. It just, it just always works. If I'm playing that kind of music. Man, this is it. This is the last one. Yeah. All right. I got one. I got one. This is a good, this is a good this to go on. This is a good late night banger. I don't always agree with this man's actions when it comes to dealing with, you know, people and, and people he's dating and things like that. But Chris brown forever always slaps. And that just, you just trail off into the night and day. All right. You know, I think R Kelly is still available to read. Kelly is worse than Chris brown. I felt like. That's a wonderful song. So. And if we can do a whole podcast about that subject. Dean. That's an excellent choice read. And if you're gonna play any Chris brown song, you can pick one from before he was an a*****e. So there you go. And when you say a*****e on this thing, I'm sure he can bleep it out. Earlier than that fan. I'm not going to edit this. This anyone's made it this far. We're an hour and we're gonna, we're gonna roll with it. All right, Alan, this is your big, last song. After virtually every wedding. When I see my 15 year old daughter, she has one question for me. Did you play any Taylor swift? And so. When I told her about this podcast. She's like, are you going to pick, shake it off? And I'm like, yes, Lauren, I will pick shake it off. So that is my 10th round pink. I have to go on. I think that's a good one. That would have been my pick Helen. That would have been your last pick I'm privileged to have stolen something from you tonight. Or today. 10 A and 10 B. So I'll go with 10 B if. If David lets me. Oh, is it my turn? I have so many. I don't have to come down to one. I don't want to say this is my last song, but I feel like we haven't said this one. Near and dear to my heart. Oh, God. There's way too many guys. But I'm going to, I'm going to have to give it to love shack. Hmm. Love shack. I also also covered the B 52 something. And the favorite. So California. It was like a, a summer concert series and they played. And then the band that did manic Monday, who is that? Bengals. They did that. It was love shack. And then the band goes, play it. [Unknown] bigger. Silver's really the hotspot the following week. In the summer of, well, we have the summer of 2009. That wasn't, that was a crazy year there. I like David. Yeah. That's but was that your, what. He's busted. Yeah, thank you. Sorry. I was like, what's the song you just picked? Okay. And that song where she says. For the third chorus. And then he says, Tin roof rest in roof. Lasting. Okay. Sorry. I thought that would go better read. Can you take care of that in post? So the good news is zoom. Didn't pick up any of David shout there. So that was fine. And then none of that, when you. None of that made it through the recording. So that was nasty. All right. Hi, Greg, this is the big last pick. Now I get to, to end the night, right? Because I had to pick lasts this whole time. I am picking. My man ed Sheeran and shape of you. There you go. One of my favorite. On one hand, the number of times I've played that at a wedding. Not thinking. It's kind of a. I like it. It's it's one that has worked. In the past. I don't know if it will in the future, but I hope it does. I don't even know what number it's on here. I think it's down quite a ways. Yeah. I'll I was going to say you didn't. Do thinking out loud. I mean, that was kind of. But, I mean, are you, are we present? Well, you could have done this little song. We were skipping some songs. You could. Yeah. I mean, I would do. So, yeah, we just skipped all the slow songs. So. I think I've, you could have put one in you. No, no. We had a nose. So song rule, if you were paying attention to the rules, It was not. This is remarkable. All right. So we got the, we have a podcast about the rules that we set up for this podcast. All right. Here's the final list and then we're going to do. I've old blaster a couple of days. Real quick. Greg had, yeah, I don't stop believing. I got a feeling, Hey, I like it. Get low brown that girl. Shall we, our family shape of you. David had September 11th, dating Mr. Brightside. It's Randy men dancing queen friends in low places. Carwash. Every time we touch truth or it's love shack. Alan shut up and dance. Uptown funk. Everybody want to be, you shook me all night long, low, come on, Eileen. Can't hold us. Don's DACA Douro and shake it off. And I had, I wanted to answer somebody can't fight the feeling or canceled their feelings. Sweet Caroline party in the USA. Footloose. This is how we do it. Living on a prayer party, rock Anthem, timber, and forever by our good friend, Chris brown. Any thoughts to that? I think your entire list read was like 120. 128. No, but it's interesting. See, I don't know. That doesn't mean anything to me. So, I mean, is that, is that good? Let me let. All like party bangers. Yeah, for sure. I couldn't mix all of those quite easily. There you go. Maybe, maybe all it means. I'll start moving. Moonlighting. As a wedding DJ, when, when the receptions get back open. The the top. Any of you say, I want Mayo do the tie. Top 20 of these requested songs, Whitney Houston. Number one, uptown font. Number two. Sweet Caroline. Don't stop believing. Yeah. Shut up and dance September. We've got all these eight Cupid shuffle. Didn't no one picked that [unknown]. Cha-cha slide. No one picked that. Friends in low places. We did pick that. I can't stop the feeling dancing queen the wobble. No one wanted the wobble. Mr. Brightside living out of their prayer. Ed Sheeran. Perfect. I got a feeling. Everybody backstreets back. Want to be in Footloose. So nice Bruno Mars marry you is on there yet. Anyway. Hey number 22. Can we get an honorable mention for sand storm? What is that out there? What is that Dan storm? No, no, no, no, no, no. I don't know that. That's an honorable mention. It goes great out of Kansas. Not the feeling too, or no, can't hold us. I did a crazy. Like on the fly mashup of that, the last wedding I did. Alan isn't that the a rally song for the Mariners. You're thinking. Ken craft. Well, it's been a long time since they've played a rally song. Whoa, whoa. That's right. There's some real fun. Yeah, remixes of that. Well, this was a fun experiment. I don't agree with all the rules. But I think, I think it was still a good experiment. But, yeah. Thank you guys. All for participating and hopefully you guys will share this on your DJ community. We'll get some views on this podcast. Anything else before we go. Well, I just want to say through in the comments. That song I mentioned before it was not living on a prayer was it's my life. It was a bunch of me roommates. Okay. I like, but I love that. It's my life. That was a good song. Bon Jovi. He, that guy knows the thing. Well, thank you so much for having us on rate. I really appreciate it. This was a ton of fun guys. This is a little more improv today, but. This was good. We'll be back with more serious docs. Next time, but yes, I appreciate it. Anyway. Yes, sir. I'll say goodbye for Alan, Greg and David.

Episode 37 (“Why Can’t I Get the RAW Photos?”)

Well, thank you all for coming. We have lively before we've even hit the record button today. I thought this was a fun topic today because we see this a lot. Photographers, you know, constantly. You know, my client wants raw photos. Mike got a family member. This get married. They want this. And so what I figured this today, we'll do this podcast and then you guys will never have to talk about it again. You can just send them the link to this podcast. So. I do think it's a good question. A lot of people have it. You know, we have three wonderful, talented photographers here today. I'm going to let Dan Manning introduce himself and then we'll go round and then we'll kind of get into the discussion. Yeah, so hi. I'm Dan Manning of Dan Manning photography. I've been shooting weddings, elopements, and family photos and all of that for way longer than I care to admit. I think I'm in familiar territory in this group. And yeah, all about, you know, customer service and providing clients with an incredible experience. And make sure it's fun and lighthearted. And yeah, just relaxed. And Jen, the one that was so important that we rescheduled this whole thing for, and then it comes on and goes, I don't mind. I don't have anything to say. I'm so sorry. We want to hear a lot about what you have to say. That's why we made this work. Why don't you introduce yourself? Thank you. My name is Jen Tai. I'm a Seattle area, wedding photographer. I'm also the managing editor of world's best wedding photos.com. Thanks for having me. And I'm so sorry. Yeah, I got the times messed up. No. Like I said, we, we chose this and this is perfect. And this is how it should be. Shawn Marcus, why don't you say hi? My name is Shawn Marcus stroll. I am also able to. Photographer of all sorts. I would say photograph everything except for your kittens and kids, because those are two things I don't prefer to photograph. And I thought you guys changed the time for me, because this was the only time slot I had. So I guess I'm just, yeah. Second film. It's your fault. Yeah. Survivor now I'm getting caught up. Why we started this schedule, this podcast around. Perfect. So. But we get this a lot. Right. I see this a lot posted, I know nothing about any of this stuff, right. I'm dummy videographer. So I guess first off. When you hear that, when you hear someone ask that like, Hey, you know, I'm trying to book a client. They want to get the raw photos. Sean, what do you think? And then we'll go back around. What's kind of just first initial gut reaction to that. Gut reaction is no, this is going to be one of those clients. And. I guess I say that because down the road, you know, they, those people tend to like nitpick everything. But I think most people ask for that because they're kind of ingrained in the thinking like that means I get all the photos and I, you know, I have more freedom to select the ones that I want. When actual, when actually I think it kind of does them a disservice because we spend so much time combing through them and editing through them to make sure that. They only get the best ones instead of. 2000 Extra photos that were someone's, you know, doing this or making a weird face or the lighting is bad or, or whatever. And they won't have time to go through all those photos like we do. So they. I don't think it's in their best interest to get all those photos. Jen, what are your thoughts on that? I haven't been asked that in a long, long time, to be honest, you know, I think that that reaction I have is that they are also into photography. You know, they really don't know what they're asking for. Like what, what. What Sean said, you know, you actually have to come through. Thousands of photos, which takes hours of time, you know? You have to color correct exposure, correct. There's a lot of work that goes into it. The other thing as well is when I think, yeah, like I said, you know, they, they probably are into photography. They want. You know, it's you. Play with the files themselves. In which case I'm not the photographer for them. You. You know, it's like you go to a restaurant and you're like, you order like some fried chicken and then you're like, just give me the chicken and the sauce and the ingredients I'll cook it myself. You know, and you're paying. The other thing as well, is that. Celebrities or, or very high, high. Profile clients sometimes ask for that as well. You know, because they, they want all rights to it. They don't want you, that's a different discussion, but that can be a myriad of reasons why they are asking for that. You know, and I have been as for that reason as well, where they don't mind me. Owning the rights. So they buy up the rights. So to the things, yeah. I asked him why. You know, and if they, the reason is because, you know, We want all the rights. We don't want this. Ending up in some magazine or whatever, then, you know, I'm like, this is the price. There's always a price to everything. Right. Yeah, so I'll call it now. I'll sell them to the boss. Dan your thoughts on this. And then also I know that cause you do in-person sales as well. And so I don't know if that skews it one way or I don't know how that works with your mind too. I just at least make sure you touch on that too. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, I mean, As John Marcus mentioned, you know, some of that is, there's a lot of test shots that we do of, you know, making sure that we get the light right. And there's a lot of shots where people just. You know, the photos aren't as flattering. It's our job, it's our responsibility. And our client's hiring us to have us, you know, complete it, complete the service for them. And you know, to me, it's kind of similar too. You know, asking someone to build a house for you, but they're really only just building the foundation and maybe like the framing and they're not actually like really finishing the job. And for us. Capturing the images is only one part of what we do. You know, editing the photos and pulling them down and delivering them in a, in a concise way. So that the clients are overwhelmed because we're the experts. We're putting the burden on ourselves to be able to actually finish the job. And in the end result, You know, that's part of the customer service that we're providing. It's the burden we place on ourselves and not on our clients, because we're the experts. We don't, we don't want them to be the experts. And, you know, as, you know, reading this one for you. You know, when you shoot like S log as a videographer, which is the raw file for videos, you shoot very fly and, you know, raw images in a general sense. I tend to shoot pretty dark. I shoot a little bit underexposed and then I bring things up. So it would just kind of look terrible. You know, as, as you see, like with videographers, You know, shooting flat with video, it looks awful. It looks really, really bad. And then once you do the color correcting and all that, it looks incredible. So for me, it's, it's all about finishing it on the, on the flip side of that one, which I think is part of the conversation we're going to go into of me being an in-person sales photographer. That means that I intentionally want people to have printed products. When it comes to. That aspect of it. We can obviously go down those rabbit holes, but that's definitely a major part of it is, is getting it printed and still providing that part of the process. So I'm trying not to like jump into that rabbit hole just yet, but we can talk about that more when we get to that. Perfect. Should I just clarify. No, they're just talking about wedding, wedding photography, right? We're not talking about commercial or any other thing, I think generally, yeah, there should be. I mean, okay. Obviously there's probably ideas that change it over, but yeah, there should be primarily focused on the event and wedding photography. That's a great question. Okay. So show Marcus, like when. So what. When you hear it. Why would someone want the raw photos? Is it like. I am afraid that there's going to be something that you guys aren't giving me, you know? Like I want, is it that I want more photos and you're giving me, is it, I mean, cause I think most of the time people don't really want to edit it unless it's like this amateur photographer want to be right. I think is it that fear of is like the FOMO, like there's going to be some shot. I don't have, I. I would say 75% of the time that people ask for the RAAs is they want all the photos and they just, I think they just use that term blankly. Raw files to me, like all of them, some want the unedited obviously, but. I think it's the FOMO. They want to make sure that they get all of the memories. But I think what they don't realize is that we're going through all those and the one shot we send you, we might have five or 10 of them that are almost the identical shot. But, you know, it's not quite perfect. And for them to have to sit there and. You know, with a very biased, I try to select the best one. I think. I used to back in the day, give them all the files. You know, 1518 Years ago. And they would come back three months, six months later. Like we haven't even gone through them all yet. And so I'm like, okay, I'm doing them a disservice. So I would select it down for them. But. They also think that we're not going to give them all those great moments where I don't set a number that I deliver. I deliver all the best moments. So. If you really think that there's something that you missed and I've said, Hey, if there's a shot that you know, that I took or that you think I might've taken, that I didn't deliver. I keep all those photos, let me know. And I've gone back and grabbed a photo that wasn't to my standard, but they really wanted it. And then I've then delivered it for them. It's fun. Yeah. That's like, Dorothy will do, you know, the iPhone will take her a couple of like selfies or whatever. Well, which one's better. One or two. Fraction of a second. Yeah. Between these two it's the same photo, right? You know, it does, it almost puts the stress on that. Jen similarly for you in terms of delivery and things like that, and the numbers of photos, is it because people think they're going to get more or do you. How does that work? Yeah. The last time I think so to be asked for that and I do ask them why, you know, and they were like, well, we just want to make sure that we have everything. And I actually came across this conversation. Well, most of the time it was the 99% of the time. The other. The person that's asking for it is the photographer or want to be photographer and they are, there's a trust issue. Right that you are not going to be giving them everything and that they want everything. Again, you know, this is years ago. If I remember correctly that I think there's a trust issue that they feel like you're not going to be honest about like delivering everything. Whereas we are actually going to. Do you a service and not have you Mitch make you sit through 15 shots at the same thing. I think once we explained that to them, then they understand, oh yeah, yeah. I do actually not want to everything. I want the coal. You know, Of the moments that, but yeah, I think that's right. That they, there was a trust issue. I feel like they feel like they won't think of everything. They actually talked, you know, Yeah. Dan, how do you balance that? And then also with the, with the in-person sales. I mean, yeah. So I'll say I agree with them. And the thing that I just add to that part before the in prison sales aspect is that. Most of the clients they ask for that, in my opinion, it either yes. Is the fact that they, they kind of want control. But the other aspect is, is that we have to remember as wedding photographers and wedding vendors, as it in general is that most of our clients have never gotten married before they're there in a claimed way, ignorant to the process of what's going on. So a lot of times they don't know what questions to ask. And so a lot of times they ask questions because, you know, maybe someone gave them advice. Who maybe also didn't necessarily know. And so a lot of times people just don't really know like what to ask for. And so they ask questions. That they draw up. And so I think it's, it's up to us to remember that we know more than them about what we do and our process. And so that education aspect is a, is a major factor. So for me, when it's mostly come up, Once I educate them. And explain to them like the why it usually really doesn't like. Evolve much further than that in the conversation. And then as far as it goes with in-person sales, because my wedding collections all come with a lay flat leather or linen album. And it includes all the digital images that are selected. Anyhow, it just doesn't come up. I mean, honestly, I never really have the issue because they're getting the printed goods. And, you know, I, I personally, I can't speak for the shine Marcus and Jen. I spend a lot of time in the customer service aspect with my clients. And so, you know, for me, I look at portrait photography is trust building anyhow. And so. They kind of tend to go hand in hand on that, that trust building. So for me, I can say I haven't really had an issue with it since way in the early days when digital was kind of fresh and. I was still learning how to be a business person and all that. But once I've I've grown. Myself and people are more used to digital and all that. I think that's definitely kind of changed the dialogue and kind of view of it. Yeah. In fact, I think nowadays people ask, you know, are you going to edit. These photos. They want that. I think the raw thing has not happened in a long, long time. Were you just getting just pure raw delivery. No, I have never done that, but the question where they launched it, You know, And then you have to explain that question has not come up in gears. You know, nowadays they're like, okay, these high risk files that we're getting they're edited. Right. You know, so it's gone the other way. These days. Well, and my question too, with that is. Do you think that that's is that a lower budget wedding question where maybe where you're in a higher level of wedding now that you don't get asked as much, do you think, is it, is that something that comes from not to use, but like budget photographers, maybe get that question more. And again, it's a trust thing, you know? So when you're priced at that, That level, you know, they probably have a lower threshold of trust, so they want some control over what they're getting. Right. Whereas, you know, when you are. Established. They, they are very, they are a hundred percent sure. You know what you're doing? You know, So I think that's, that's my take on it. It's as tough, like, you know, we, and we do the raw video with our step, but like Dan said, you know, I shoot flat to like a photographer, but I just have like a huge disclaimer in the contract. It's like, The raw footage looks like crap, you know, because it's like, I'm not shooting for your hard drive to keep it I'm shooting, you know, for the, for the, you know, your product. You know, to get the video and it is hard cause I, I, and I'm sure. There's a non-zero number of clients that have opened out and they're like WTF, you know, but like at the end of the day, you know, worst case in two minutes, you could fix a lot of those video files if you wanted to. But it's hard. It's hard to balance that and wanting, I think this society now. You know, like, I know, I think you guys know, like I did Mike tobolski like we did that. Dorothy and I did that. Like Porsche session with every, and I haven't had my photos taken in, in a decade. I was like downloading all the photos. I was like, I want all of them. Right. And it's like this weird. Where you feel like you just want all of them, even though you're never going to do anything with them. Right. Sean, do you get what I'm saying? Like it's this. It is that trust and knowing that you guys are going to deliver, but how do you balance it? Do you just walk your clients through that? And they're like, I got this. Well, actually, I was just going to say, I think before it even gets to that point, the last 10 years, I just kind of nip it in the bud and say, and explain. There's a reason you're not going to get all of it. All of them. There's a reason. I don't want you to edit any of your own. There's a reason I have this in my contract. Because you're hiring me because you've seen my work. You like the way I shoot you liked the way I edit. There's no reason for you to alter that, because if you are just like Jen said, I'm not the photographer for you. If that's your end game and that's what you want to do. And I tell them I have it in my contract. If you alter it and post it. I'm not going to come after you and Sue you, but I might nicely ask you, Hey, can you take that down? It doesn't represent the, my work and my style. So I think I kind of stop it before they even get to that point. And then if they still want that, then. You know, they might not choose me. And I'm okay with that. That was actually going to be my next question, Jen. Just about that, about, you know, having the raw photos in the same with the video and having them post or do something with it, add word filters and stuff. I mean, again, this, that. Stuff that you guys nip in the bud, you deal with that anymore. I see, you know, a lot of complaints about, you know, Not so much in the last couple of years, but I felt like forever. It was like, oh my God, they put this. You know, Cynthia filter on it or whatever, is that? How do you, is it just again trust or how do you balance that? Dan chick. Only one of the clients. I said a high profile client who bought the raw files and they're expensive. Right? You're. You're actually in front. Loading a kind of fee on the raw files, you know, because we do provide the Cali and then they get the raw files and there was a separate contract with a couple of new clauses in it where, and there's no attribution, cause I've already sold those rights. So you don't need to tag me. You don't need to do anything. It's like commercial. Right. So when you shoot for like any kind of magazine or. Ad ad agency. You're giving them the raw files. They don't attribute you with the ad. You know, the photographer. You're selling all those rights. But these days, if they apply a filter, even on my edited file, they share, they do it on Instagram. I really don't care. You know, I mean, what do you want to do? You know, it just creates a bad feeling and. So far, you know, I don't even remember the last time somebody did it, or I just don't know that they did it, you know, and right now I just cost me more anguish and time and money to do that than just letting it go. You know, right. I think. I mean. It's so much anguish. You. It's like, oh God, that awful filter. But I would have to say that it happens very rarely these days. Not that I know of. Nobody has brought it to my attention. You know, I feel like it's kind of. Gone past that, to where people are starting to realize it a little bit more. Well, that's good. I definitely think there's a lot more education of photography in general from our clients now that, you know, especially. Like Instagram is so popular. People are so used to seeing photos and they desire a look, you know, before it was always kind of an intangible there wasn't a rational behind like why they like something. And I think now that it's, so ever-present with social media. People. Understand whether it's internal or, you know, like. Subconsciously or consciously. They recognize, like why they're hiring each one of us. And that's an important factor for every photographer that. You know, he's been doing this for a while. Is all of us know like, Hey, I'm not the right photographer for everybody. My style is different. I think the clients are, are just overall becoming more in tune with that. And they're hiring us because of the editing. Not necessarily, you know, it's a huge factor in it now. So I, I'm definitely seeing less of the filters that people put on the photos than I used to. And yeah, I remember myself and so many photographers would post it and, you know, we were like, we, a lot of us are like in the same, like, you know, Facebook groups for photographers and. People used to just get outraged and like post in these Facebook groups. So unposted my photos and they put a filter on it and like, I think anybody has been doing it. More than like, probably like four to six years. We don't care anymore. It's just, it's one of. They put the filter just. Don't tag me. Yeah. Yeah. It's like, that's how I don't know about it. That's good. You. I just don't want to be tagged in it. You know, we have one. Couple of years ago and they, it was the sister of the groom. I re edited the whole video, like just, but it was all like the flat S log. I mean, it wasn't like a ten second clip. I mean, it was the whole, it was like, like a 20 minute to 10 minute things. And I was like, I please tag me in any of this, please. Don't. I mean, I don't, I don't really care, but I guess, yeah, while we're on the topic in, in wanting to, I think it's good. Dan touched on this with that. You know, the RA and the photo manipulation. I mean, just last week I was talking about their client booking and they go, well, you know, can we send you a bunch of videos that we like? And I'm like, why. I hope they're on my website, you know? I don't like, I don't, you know, not to be, but you know what I mean? This is still a thing. So. Sean, how do you, you. Cause I think this goes hand in hand and the raw in trusting your photographer and the style and everything. How do you balance that? Well, I actually kind of encourage my couples to send me stuff that they like. And I will. I tell them I'm like, I will either tell you. This is something I can do. Not do or don't want to do. I'm like, okay, well, Always people like, oh, I want the sunset photo and what the sunset photo Mike. I can't predict the weather on your wedding day. You know, like they see the ones on my website. I'm like, yeah, that was a one in a million sunset that day. Like. Yep. Make that happen. Sure. I can edit it in, but I'm not going to do that because I like to shoot. Your day and edit your day as it is, and just make it look its best. But I also like to know what people want. And I will tell them like, okay, that is not my style. I'm probably not the photographer for you. Like, you know, the really rich oranges and, and de-saturated greens that people are doing now. Like that's not my style. Go with someone else that does do that. And I will send them elsewhere. But sometimes our shots where I'm like, okay, no, that's a really fun shot. We can definitely do that at your venue or somewhere close by. So. That way, I kind of get to feel what they're into and I'm not going to deliver something or try to shoot something that they're not into. That's a good point. Yeah. John that yeah. When you. Are shopping for a photographer, a URL. You're not going to find somebody and then customize and look, it doesn't work that way. You know, you have to define the photographer with the style. And look that you want. It does then it's not like a. You know, go to a restaurant and you pick your lobster and then. Cook it Thermidor, you know, when I only grow it. Yeah. That's the way this chef does it. You know, I really love to use them. The restaurant analogy is easily. Understood. You know how it works. Yeah. You don't go in and. Try and cook everything yourself, you know? That defeats the purpose of going to a restaurant. Doing that. Right. You go, go to, what, what do you call it? Michelin star thing. And you're like, okay. I like it done this way. I want this to look like that. You know, I wanted to. Brought to me like this, you know? Nope. It doesn't work like that. You know, you get what you get. You'll, that's what you're paying for, you know? Dan. I see you nodding. Yeah. I mean, I, I definitely agree with all that. And I use restaurant analogies all the time. But, yeah, it's, it's one of those where, you know, number one, If someone, I just had a great call with a inquiry for a wedding last night. And I was, I was actually talking to the client about that. Exactly. Of. You know, it's, it's wonderful for anybody. There's so many wonderful photographers, especially in Seattle. There are too many good photographers in Seattle. It's kind of appalling how many really like world-class photographers are here. So anytime that any one of us gets an inquiry from one of these clients, it's, it's a really wonderful thing. And it's something that, you know, for me is very meaningful. As I, as I told the client on the phone. You. She told me she saw my website. She told me she saw on my Instagram, so right away. I just straight up said to her, I'm very blunt and for it. And I was like, you saw my work clearly. You like my style of work. So, you know, and it was, there was context behind it. I'm not going to go to the whole backstory, but you know, it was just acknowledging that. At that point. I determined within myself. I don't have to like sell them on my shooting style or my editing style because they called me amongst you. I don't even know. There's like a hundred plus photographers in our market right here. Are all really good thousands. Really good. I mean like, well, there's a hundred that are really good. There's thousands of them, but there's, there's like a hundred. I mean, like in any market could be one of the top photographers, but yeah, there there's a lot of photographers. So, you know, the simple fact at that point once, once they get to that point, it's, it's just nice to be able to let it go. John Marcus, you can sing that again. If you'd like. Yeah, but no. So at that point, you know, I, I try not to like focus on that aspect with them. And then I work with them within my shooting style and the way I do things to then customize further, as far as, do you want more candid? Do you want more hoes? You know what, what's the balance of that. And so I tend to kind of go down that path a little bit more and focus a little bit less on that aspect. Because then it gives me creative control. So when the conditions change and it's a cloudy day versus a sunny day, I don't have to like try to fit something in a box that doesn't work. So just a little bit different way. As far as it goes with me. No, that's. It's just, it's hard because in this goes back to, you know, the raw photos and the shooting. You know, when people ask, you know, can you shoot that kind of video? Yeah, I hate saying no, right? Like we're in the customer service industry. Right. And so I'm looking at chef Marcus here because I want to hear, how do you, cause you know, you're a little wildly like me sometimes. Right? You can be a little. Well, you know, we can be blunt. And so it is hard where, you know, we're trying to sell ourselves and our service, but then you have someone all, I want all the raw photos or I want all this, or I want all that and it's not. In their best interest or something that you do or something that you can do. I mean, how do you approach that? I just try to be as open and blunt about who I am from the get-go from my first phone call or first email or whatever. I just put myself out there, like. And I tell them, I'm like, Me or whoever you pick as your photographer will be with you the entire, or at least I am. I am with you from the time you started getting ready till the time you leave. That's how I like to work. I don't like an hourly thing, but I'm like, I will be there the entire time. If you don't choose me, another photographer will probably be there like six to eight long hours. If you don't like them. Don't hire them. No matter how much you liked their photos. Yep. They will ruin your day if you don't like them. So hire photographer that you like and you like their work. That's it. Jen had a story. Yeah. Don't ask for the wrong. Now I give you the wrong. I, yeah. Jen, how do you handle that trust? And, and, and not wanting to say no, but still wanting to kind of deliver that. You know, good client experience. Yes. This is John Marcus. You know, there's a lot of education that either come in, you know, there's a, you know, banter and, and getting to know each other. And then once you build a little bit of trust, what you say that comes out of your mouth, they believe. You know, because then you are actually just speaking in there using your effort expertise, too. Tell them something that is good for them. They don't know it. You know, they don't know what they're asking for. Most of the time, I would say even if they think they know what they're asking for. They're not wedding photographers. Right? So they out for them. There's like you're talking potentially 4,000 files. You know, 15 files of the same pose, the same group. Go blank. You. You actually really want to filter through it. No 15 photos of the same pose and then times a hundred. No, you don't. You know, so yeah, once they usually, I would say nine. A hundred percent of the time, once you laid down for them, they like nod and they believe you. Right. And because it's the truth, it's not something fun that, that you want them to go through unless it's fun. So they might sing. It's fun. It's not, you know, it's it's work, right. That's why we get paid to do it. That's why you're paying me to do it. But like I said, you know, we rarely come across these kinds of questions anymore. Unless it's commercial work. You know, You just don't want people feeling like they're hoodwinked, right? I mean, it's, it's a hard balance. They don't know, they've never done it. You know, they're yes. They have heard horror stories, maybe of someone else getting the funding for those, or, you know, vague cater without you. It's just, it's a hard. You're building this. Yeah. This immediate trust for a very important, there is a yes in there somewhere. Because I do ask them what the reason is. Right. If the reason is for, you know, I just, you know, I'm a high profile person. All my boss is a high profile person. He just says he just wants to buy all the rights. In that case, there is a price to it. You know, why is it more expensive than if I had edited it? Because, you know, I don't, I can't use those photos anymore. I've lost opportunity costs to cover, right? So this is the reason that they expect that if they are high profile, they have dealt with this before. So this is normal for them, you know, but if the reason is because you are at least thinking that you are missing out on photos, there's lack of trust there that I'm going to deliver all the important stuff to you. Then there's education that I can lay down for you. Whether at the end of the day, you're going to accept it or not. You know, it's up to you. If you don't, then there's other photographers that might do it for. For you like, just without question you. I'm sure there is, you know, But it's not going to be me. Right. Yeah. Can I add to Jen? Won't there about the 15. Shots of the exact same pose. I also like to mention to my clients that the reason I'm only going to deliver one, two or three of the exact same shot is I'm going to deliver. The best one. If I'm relying on the client to pick their favorite. They're going to pick the one where they think they look best and not the photo itself where. We're going through all of them and with our gut reaction, we know exactly which one to select because we're picking the shot. That we're the whole thing looks the best and not just where the bride looks the best or where the groom looks the best where, you know, it's the entire thing looks as good as it can look. That's the one we're going to deliver and we might include the one where the bride and groom look the best because we know they're going to like that one, but yeah. And if that is always my life. You thought Dorothy looks better. And I look like, you know, What's the guy from the Goonies and the other one chunk or whatever as always. [Unknown] or like it'll be out of focus. I look better in that one. Like, if it's blurry. You guys pick. I have always paid way or the bride and groom looks at bats. I don't really care. You know, Like the cousins at the end. Yeah. In a group photo. Has a weird luck. Yeah. I mean. Okay. The bride and groom look good. Yeah. I mean, if that's the deciding factor, if the person on the end is, you know, has a slight blank, what's going to be. Dan. We'll start with you on this. And I want to go through, I want to talk about getting prints and things, you know, what do you do with your photos? We have the photos, you know, they're edited or, you know, whatever. They're not, we're not getting Rafa those. Now we're doing things the right way. You know, Dorothy loves, we have photos printed everywhere, a big we're, big fans of the, you know, the, the printed. Further here. So what, what did we do? Yeah. So it starting with number one is I talked to my clients about this one. And explaining why I do the things I do and why my weddings come with, you know, lay flat album or way like my family sessions or engagement sessions don't come with any digitals until they actually order products first. I just take people and I'm like, Hey, you want a smartphone four years ago. Right. And they're like, yeah, my cool. Did you shoot a bunch of photos with it? They're like, yeah. I'm like, where are they? And they're like, Ooh. When was the last time you looked at them? Oh, why do you think your wedding photos are going to be any different than the cellphone photos before years ago? Oh, we're going to go print them. Oh, so right away, as soon as you just establish that baseline where they realize, I don't know, I have no idea. On all of those things, it pushes it into, Hey, when you have photos up on the wall and you actually see them. They have a life. And there is something that is really. Magical about being able to actually print it and go through a professional lab, which we have access to as photography. Isn't it. At this point now there were a few labs that were available to regular consumers that you didn't have to have a business license to go through and they've all shut down or gone only pro. So the truth is, is that regardless of, of our decisions, our clients don't have access to those labs anymore. And they certainly aren't the experts on that one, you know, as we, as they were talking about before. You know, education is so critical and we have to just always step back and remember that. It's easy for us in this dialogue. Like this conversation for all of us here is really simple and it kind of almost feels probably a little bit kind of patronizing for us to have this conversation because we're so in tuned with it. But we have to remember that our clients don't know all this stuff and it's, it's new. And it's overwhelming, you know, planning a wedding is very overwhelming. You know, any kind of photography session for a lot of people is overwhelming. So, you know, when we take control and say, Hey, I got this and push in that process of, you know, getting something printed and on the wall, it's important. I mean, I can show you, like, I'm going to turn my camera. I have a wall over here. It's a little messy, but the photos of my family and all that, and my kids all the time, they're like kids, they're almost seven and five. And they all the time go over and look at those photos and talk about them in. Even there's a lot of photos that are on the wall that are from before they were born, they ask about them and they know the stories because they see it. So I get to see it in person in real life of the meaningfulness of getting them printed. And I'm not saying that's for every client, so there's a lot of photographers that don't offer that. And that's totally fine. I'm not going to be for every single client, but if people reach out to me and they like my work and that's something that's important to them. They tend to hire me. And if that's something it's not important to them, They'll go hire somebody else and that's okay. I don't want people to, first of all, be educated, right? I mean, if you don't know. Then. They're not going to be able to consciously make an intelligent decision to hire me or somebody else. So I'd rather them get the education and then end up with someone that they're going to be happy with because ultimately. Most, all of us photographers want clients to have a good experience with photographers as a whole, even if it's not with us. And I think that's a really amazing thing that we have, especially in this local community. That's that's really cool. How do we show Marcus? How do we was the best? You know, why do I not go to Costco and get my photos printed? I guess. You don't go to Costco. I had a client years ago. They. Came back to me and they're like, we don't like any of our photos. Blah, blah, blah. You know, they look all washed out and frozen. And, you know, It's like, well, you know, let me, let me pull them back up. You know, let's go through them and, and I was going through and I'm like, no, these all look good. And I'm like, what did you do? Where are you looking at? What, what, what is going on now? Well, we went to Costco and we printed them all out. I'm like, oh dear God. That's okay. Let me stop you right there. Costco will do a, you know, just an automatic batch. Adjustment to one set of photos and that's how they run them all. You know, They all get kind of. You know, washed out and muted and they don't want them to come out looking the way the photographer edited, edited them. They want them all to kind of look at, you know, as generically okay. As possible. So that, you know, the untrained, I won't be like, oh, well we want to take these back to be reprinted. So one thing, by the way, As of March Costco shot. Yeah. They shut down all over there. Photo labs. So not even an option anymore. Yeah, just in general. Taking it. So I told them, I'm like, you know what, let me get a couple printed for you. I sent them back out and they're like, no, we love them. I'm like, thank you. That's all. Don't go from then on I'm like don't ever take any of these prints. To any place other than one of the places, you know, that I do print them from, or if you're going to print them, here's a couple of places that do a good job. So take them there. No, cause it's hard in general. I want to get your thoughts on this too, because you know, You know, you're spending all the money on the wedding, right. We're spending the money on the photographer and the, oh God. Now I got the glide tape. He's right. Like, I mean, I get why people would just want to bring them up, you know, like printed at Walgreens. I mean, I get it right. So, so how do you. Is it just when they're spending enough and they know, or, I mean, it just, cause I get that. God, this is like one more thing I got to pay for and do, and really make sure we do right. I really don't know of any, like, they don't tell me that they go print their photos at Walgreens or wherever, you know, I don't follow. I would say, Hey, what are you doing with your photos? Like one year from now? You know, but I do use my I'm on peak time, which, you know, has products that they can buy and I can see them coming back. Over the year or two years to make prints. I have this mom who had still buy prints from, from my gallery, like. It's been one year since the men in Florida. You know, and she was like, what happened to the thing? You know? And I was like, it's still there. I sent her the link and she brought a couple of friends, you know? So I really don't know if they've not come back to me to, to say that things are not looking. Good. You know, I'm assuming that they're going to some good labs. If they ask me, I will, you. Refer them to like white house. This does do consumer, you know, artifact uprising does consumer and then M. Peaks. I don't know if that's still online. The last I heard they are not doing consumer anymore. So yeah, like John, I refer them to some online people. I, I discouraged them from going to like Walgreens or Walmart. Cause I have no control. There was a clause in my contract that says that I can't be responsible for how the prints look, if you don't order them from me. That's about it. You know, I can't force them to buy from me, but I do have the option to make it really easy for them if they want. You know, Cause the Gavin was still up. So that's, that's how that works in that they're able to write w we're Dan, they purchased some through you, Jen. I mean, is that, cause I don't know any of this stuff. Right? So people go on. If they have. The photos where they're able to order them through services. Is that how that works? So it's a online gallery that we have a part of. Once they see their photos, each photo has like a bio option and when they click on it, you can buy prints and books and wall art and stuff like that. You know, and then throughout the year I run like a sales, you know, like mother's day is coming, I run a campaign and then now I see like a couple of hundred bucks, you know? Prints and stuff like that. So that's how I do it. You make it the experience of shopping and buying from you. So it was so fun and, and, and, and easy that they compare it to like Costco and Walgreens layer. They have to go there maybe, or uploaded online and they don't have the best systems. All right. It's not as beautiful as our galleries that they shop from you. So you try and entice them to buy from you instead of worrying that they're going to print. At this place, you know, cause really we have no control over that. You know, once we give them. I mean the way that my family packages are set, you. There are three tiers. You know, one tier has nothing in it. The most expensive tier has all the fries. You know, it's $1,500. So you want all the files who pay for it. Right. There is a price to it, and most people actually pay it, you know, because they want to worry about the bind later, but you know what. They still come back to the gallery. So they paid $1,500 and they still come back. Later in the year to buy from you because you're running a sale and it's just easy and fun. And it's beautiful. You know, the galleries look better than Walmart or possible. Should people do photos already. Already there. You have to upload your photos to Costco to get them printed. Right? Yeah. Yeah, sure. People know that when they're, once they pay you guys, you know, you know, we're doing the work and then when they go back and they're ordering prints, is that is other really good. Not like moneymaker, Mattamy. Is that a really good way to support the photographers that they know. Right. I mean, do you guys. Do you feel is that right? Sure. Sure. Does everyone. We're supporting a small business, you know, you're supporting a small business during COVID. You know, this is one of the ways that we keep going. We don't really make, we're not millionaires. You know, and so instead of supporting Walmart, I'm not a millionaire. And so think about it. You would give a client a choice of supporting a local small business versus a big conglomerate. Well, all marts. Or Costco, what do you. I don't. I. It's the choice is easy for me. I would support a local, small business. You know, Yeah. And thoughts on this. Yeah. I just said. Thoughts on this and, and support the photographers that you have enjoyed having spent your wedding day with you. What was the last thing you said it kind of cut out? Oh, I just said that I had the best support, the photographers that have spent their day, your wedding day with you. Gotcha. Yeah. I personally had built really strong relationships with my clients. And so, you know, often kind of turns into a friendship type of situation and. It is, it is nice in that regard. When people do that, I try to price like my, my pricing strategy and the way I do things is that. I'm not heavily reliant on people ordering products, but. It definitely is a part of what I do because I really want people to actually. You know, like I talked about earlier of, you know, if. If you, if you put us in the idea of like construction and like building a home. Printing the products is, is part of that, in my opinion, for me in my business. That's just how I do things. And again, it's not in any way. Saying that other photographers aren't completing the job. That's just my personal feeling. Is that. I'll have the same as Jen, we're having an online gallery that I send them and there's a store that they can go purchase their, their products there as well. Like wall art books and albums and all of that. I actually encourage them as much as possible, too. Do a zoom call with me. So I often try to have them go through and favorite photos in their gallery. And I talked to them usually in person or via zoom call or a phone call and say, Hey, you know, you looked at the store. What products do you think you might want? And then I go through and I either create mock-ups or samples to show them, and I do a video call and then as much as possible, I actually do all the ordering for them. So they don't have to it's. It's one of those where, again, they're not the experts. I am. I want to take that burden off of their shoulders so that they don't have to spend the time trying to figure out a system that's new to them. So, you know, I try to make it a, you know, as a business person, if you can make it as simple as you can for someone to give you money. You're going to, you're going to be profitable and stay in business. And then from a customer service side of it, for our clients to hear that. I'm doing the work for you and yes, I'm charging more money than you would pay to go to Walgreens or whatever else. But you're going to get a much higher quality product. I guarantee you literally guarantee is going to be professional. It's going to look right and you don't have to do any of the work. And it is just something where you get to sit back and just be present and not put it in the mental energy to do that. And. The clients really appreciate that because it gives them a feeling of being taken care of and comforted in a process that otherwise it'd be emotionally taxing and overwhelming to them. So that's just my personal kind of style on that one. For it. Shawn final thoughts here. We'll let everyone get out of here on a, Jen's got to hit the, hit the GM, and I gotta go, like it. Take to get my car. My oil change. So final thoughts. A final thought is just. You know, let us do what we're trained to do trust us and know that we will deliver. All of your memories in the way that they should be in the way that we both agree. Everybody likes. Yeah, because ultimately it is. And that's one thing that keeps coming back and all these discussions we've had even back to, we did a, you know, hiring a photographer round table and hiring the DJ round table and, you know, finding people that you trust, right. That you vibe with. And just knowing that they're going to. It's hard. I get it. You know, I mean, we, I, we put a deck on our house and got, you know, Good waiting to bamboozle the way. So I get that, you know, I get the fear there. So, so it is, but, you know, finding people that you vibe with and especially for your wedding day and not having to, you know, do things yourself and get confused and, and get all their off of those and everything else is good. Final comments from anybody or we'll kick everybody out of here. No. Yeah. What John said, you know, John mark has said, it's when you shop for a photographer, you know, no Franklin referrals, you know, look at all the reviews, you know, once you have like 50 good reviews or whatever that amount is and improve it for. So, you know, you have that trust. You're not going to get bamboozled. Number one. Now, now go down to the style, pick the style that you like. That's step two. And then number three, set up a consult. See if you jive with each other. Right. Once all three things hit the mark. You you're in good hands. You know, I want to believe that you're all good people and all the people here in this panel are great people, you know? We've, we've not heard terrible stories about. About anybody seriously, trust your gut. And trust the reviews and referrals. Dan, anything else? Yeah, I mean, You nailed it on the head. Both of you guys. It's it's, you know, first of all, it, you know, It's just like a relationship, but you see somebody, first of all, it is the attraction, right. People will see another person and I'm like, wow, there. They're cute, you know, so that that's still no matter what, as superficial as it is, you know, our ultimate job is to create, oh yes, I was talking about your age. Our, our ultimate job is to provide photos of the clients feel. Beautiful. And, and th they get to really appreciate it. So that, that is, you know, going to be the most important, but as, as both of you guys said, That, that connection and that trust is absolutely everything great. Portraiture is all about really. The claims to being able to let down their guard. And just be, and just feel really comfortable and relaxed with the person that they're working with. And. At that point is where we're talking about weddings, right? It's where you get to just be at your wedding and exist. And the work of getting your picture taken is effortless because, you know, Wholeheartedly you trust the person. So it's really critical when you're vetting, photographers and deciding who you're going to hire to find people that you really do safe with you feel safe with and you connect with, and that you do trust. And that is such. It's in my opinion, it's equal if, if almost not more important than the actual like work itself, because it will just naturally make you look better in the photos by having that trust. You'll look more like yourself, so that's. Yeah. Once you have all of that, you don't need the raw files. And then you don't need the raw files. Yeah. You know, you don't need the raw files, you know? All right. What you're saying is that we're more important than the person you're marrying. That's what I'm picking up. Where you have to talk to Stacy about that one. Grab this whole scrap this whole interview now. Or. Everything they said. Yeah. If you're a shy Marcus, don't you just see your own wedding photos, right. And then you get your own. Yep. Yeah. Well, when, when, when 15 people tell you where you can't photograph your own wedding, who are you going to hire? I'm like, No, I'm going to prove you wrong. I'm going to photograph. Started from the other day. I was so glad we got shut out Marcus on Dan's for non before Jens. You know, old favorites too. And so I'm glad we could get you on as well. Thank you all so much again for this fun and, and hopefully helpful discussion. And we'll see, I'll put everyone's info and everything. So we'll see you all next time.

Episode 36 (All About Tents!)

Well, thank you guys all so much for coming on. This was a Greg Lauder exclusive. I was talking to Greg and Allen. I said, you know, we need some new topics for best meet weddings. And Greg had suggested. Tents and, and, and outdoor kind of situations like that. And I don't know anything about that at all. And it's something that. But I think that we are going into this, like a lot of couples do where I don't know, a lot of times we talk about like photography or, you know, DJ stuff. And I kinda know a little bit, I think this is interesting today because I'll be learning kind of alongside everybody about, you know, what do we need to know about these sorts of things? You know, when the book, your tent, you. You know, are we doing different sizes, locations, all the kinds of stuff that I don't even I'm sure questions. I don't even think about asking right now. So Mallory, why don't you introduce yourself? And then we'll go to Scott and then we'll get into this. Yeah. So I'm Mallory Bailey. I used to be wedding planner, and now I am a project manager for corporate. 40 Rental. And specialized in like the mid to high level. Weddings with like a 5k to 250 K budget. Awesome. And Scott, what about you? Yeah. So I'm Scott Alexander. I'm the current owner and president of Alexander party rentals. I grew up in the tent rental industry. I'm second generation owner of a tent rental company. We do a lot more than just weddings, but we definitely focus very heavily on tented wedding events. It's a big part of what we do. It's interesting to think about. Well, and obviously where you've grown up in it a little bit, but like it, at what point you go, I'm going into the tent rental business. Like something that is certainly a necessary. Right. But it is an interesting, however, when you know, professionally, I never thought I would be a wedding videographer either. So how did you. Talk about that just first off, I I'm fascinated about that. Ooh. So I went to school for molecular biology, actually. So I D I. Clearly a different field. I think. It just happened that I graduated, like in the trough of the recession, which was 2009. And my parents were definitely struggling and needed some help. And. I, we found success running a business together, and I decided as it grew and we. I learned a little more about it, that it was actually something I wanted to do his career and decided to fully take it over. 2014. Awesome. And Mallory, where you came from. You know, The other side. Right. And I'd you feel like you running the rentals and the behind the scenes stuff now, having kind of gone through that whole world for a long time, you really have seen both sides of the coin, right? I have. Yeah. So before I was a wedding planner, I also worked at different venues. From small, like boutique hotels to like large corporate convention center hotels. So having then the client in multiple different aspects is super helpful when helping clients plan, because there's a lot of things that they don't know, they need. So being able to be like, have you thought about where your catering tents going to be? Well, I didn't know I needed a catering tent, so it is very helpful with clients and couples. Well, good. I think we got a good, you know, between you guys today to walk through some of this stuff. I think, especially in the Pacific Northwest, you know, weather-wise, you know, so dependent, you know, having Kantz, you know, are we doing the ceremony outside? And then also, you know, we were talking before we recorded about everything going on now with regulations, with the numbers of peoples and things and, and, you know, COVID regulations, you'll try and do extend out right spaces to be able to accommodate whatever. So I think it's going to be a good time we discussion today, but I think also it should last, you know, hopefully a while just in terms of what we need to know. We joked before we started, you know, the number one question that people should know. You know, when should I book my tent? Right. And you guys both joke, you know, last month or whatever. So I guess Mallory, we'll, we'll start with you on that. And then we'll, we'll continue the conversation. You know, if someone's thinking about doing that, I guess, is that the first question when you book or how do you know, I guess if I'm looking at the venue, how do I know if that's something that I even need to consider? If I'm a couple of planning, the wedding. Yeah. So a lot of the couples that come to any rental company really that need tents. What I have seen is a lot of people at their own home. And so it's really building from the ground up. At a private residence or sometimes in the middle of the field in Eastern Washington. There are many venues as well that people add tents to just share capacity reasons. But I think the, the first thing they usually ask after getting a quote is when should I book. And always telling couples and clients that as soon as possible, cause because of labor tents. Are very labor heavy. And so making sure, depending on the size of the tent, No. If someone just needs like a, a smaller tent just for their catering. That could go up in an hour or so, but if someone needs. A tent that holds 200 people plus their food and dancing, and they want a floor and power and HVAC and everything. It could be a multiple day project. So being able to make sure we have the right labor on the books for them is. Crucial. Scott. Is it something to think about? I guess nowadays you have so many venues that you maybe have a tent or it's a small tent, or they don't like Mallory's talking to you in the backyard. What are you guys finding now in terms of just being called to come out to places to accommodate that? Is it, is it common now that most venues aren't set up for that and you guys have to bring in everything? I mean, what do you. You know, when people are looking for venues, is that something they need to consider like, oh, we can add a tent anywhere. We don't have to worry. You know, in terms of like, you know, finding the right venue that also can accommodate that. Right. So specifically with the venues, it's going to vary by venue. We work with a lot of venues that specifically have set up their grounds around adding tents and some then use, do own their own. That's that they're going to put up for the season. Many don't do that because it can kill their grass or kill just the greenery that makes the venue what the venue is. But I I'm sure that court, as well as our company. You know, we've, we've worked with many venues where we have very specific footprints for tents that works very well for the size of events that they do there. And also reduce the impact. On their grounds. And make it very clean. Install for the bride and groom. So I definitely work with. Your venue and your rental company, and make sure that they're talking with each other and. Good communication. Yeah. Do you find that most of the time, I guess we'll go to Malheur and then Scott Day, most of the time, is it. Th the couple connecting you with the venue. Are you guys already talking with them? How does that work in terms of the dynamic of making sure everyone's on the same page? I really think it goes both ways. A lot of times we're getting the venue saying, giving their, our contact information to the couple and saying, reach out, they know the venue well, and if it's the reverse, then not as usually one of the first things we as rental companies would ask is. Is does this fit at the venue? If we, as my company, if we've never been there before, we'll go out and we'll do a site visit, we'll meet the owner, meet the manager to make sure we can actually put a tent there. Cause sometimes people just think, oh, I can just put a tent in their parking lot and a venue. Says, absolutely not. Yes guys. Is that something too, that you guys. If you haven't been, if it's, especially if it's like a private residence that you guys have to go out and do that site visit. Yes, site visits are key and every company that does what we do. Aware of offers those pretty much complimentary. They're really important beyond just saying, is the temp going to sit in a space? We have to look at things like, can we stake? Which is the way that most tents are held down because there's a whole safety factor. But sense that we have to make sure they're not just going to be a giant tight. Because that's frankly, what they turned into into the wind. And if we can't stay. That means we have to balance. So we have to talk with some venue about how much weight we can bring in and where we can put it. Cause it does. Have a footprint on their grounds. More than that. When we're dealing with a new venue, we have to know what their protocol is for load-in and load-out how much time we're going to have to build a tent. Especially some of the more popular wedding venues, they may be asking us to set up someone's tent. The evening. Before after the previous event and then tearing that out. You know, same night of the event. Which really puts a lot of pressure on the rental company. And that's something you really want to make sure you have talked through in advance with the vendor. Just because that it may not be feasible. Especially if you're only looking a month out. For us to provide that kind of labor. Yeah, it's definitely something that you have to think about. I just we're getting ready for the, like the Snohomish wedding tour here coming up and we just got emails and yeah. You know, some of the vendors are loading in, you know, Thursday, Friday in anticipation of the Sunday date. Right. Like you said that that night before or a night out load out, especially if something's going until midnight, it's not going to happen. Days before is preferred. Absolutely. Yeah, I, we, I remember a couple years ago we did the wedding nit shot to Lil, and they had had some, like a separate tent brought in, you know, besides kind of whatever that they have on the side there. And I think one of the couples got a discount so that they could keep the 10 up for the whole. Because it was, it was easier than having to break that down. And then between. Oh, yes, definitely. We can come on Thursday, pick up on Tuesday. Great. Thank you. So if I'm, you know, if we decide that we need some outdoor accommodations, I, in terms of like scale and size and options, I mean, I'm sure it's, it's. Limitless, but also limited. So I guess where does that start? Mallory, if I'm trying to figure out, you know, W, what do I need? Is there a number of people, all that kind of stuff. Yeah. We ask couples and clients a lot of questions before we recommend a tent. So I'm asking first, obviously how many people are coming. How basically, how are you going to use the tent? Are you going to have a seated dinner? That's plated. Do you need to have room for a buffet? Are you going to be dancing? Are there going to be bars? Is there going to be lounge? Basically, what's going to go underneath the tent right now is a weird world of. Are you six feet apart? Which they seem to be doing. Are you doing 10 people per table? Are you doing six? Like, that's been a whole weird thing to now put into the kind of. Protocol of what you ask, but once all those questions are asked and after a site visit is typically done. And what, you know, you have to work with. Then from there, it's easy to figure out what size tent someone might need. So if someone thinks they need a 20 by 30, but they have a hundred people in a dance floor, you know, as a temp professional off the top of your head, that's not going to work. So providing them with a diagram to show them, well, this is how. This can all fit into your tent. And then telling them from there, what their options are for, if they did want to go bigger or smaller. You know, what can we eliminate? What can we add on this is how much room you have to grow. If your guest count grows. And then also figuring out for them. You know where other tents might be in location or what's our path here? Are we walking a hundred feet down. Cliff to get there, kind of all those other logistics come with that too. I guess, God, that is an interesting question, obviously, with, you know, Changing regulations all the time now, but just in general, guest counts grow and shrink when it comes to any wedding. Right. Even, even in normal times. And so is it something where you're over, if I'm a couple, am I over guessing size and then we can always downsize just the number of people in, you know, inside, or how does that work then not end up with this massive space that maybe isn't filled properly. Right. So I, I always recommend that clients book. Book temps that's for their largest guest counts that they would anticipate. So however many invitations they're sending out. Minus out of the typical 20% probably of attrition that's normal. It's pretty easy to normally shrink, attends the tents are modular and we can just kind of. Take a mid out. And you're, you know, 40 by 60 went down to the 40 by 60 or something like that. It's a little more difficult, especially when we talk about labor again, and then availability. If all of a sudden you go from saying, I want that 40 by 60 10 to now you need a 40 by one 20. You did that week. You're gonna be a little bit at the whim of the tent company. What they can make happen. Certainly, I know we will do everything we can in that scenario. I'm sure court is the same way. We're all in business to try to run as much stuff as we can on any given weekend, but there are limits to what we can do last minute. So I think the best advice I would have is, is book. The biggest thing you can. You know, if you start to see your desk guest count. Dwayne delay. Tell your tent company with as much notice as you can that you think you want us. You know, shift down. Mallory, when you were talking about trying to figure out, you know, bar and dance for and stuff like that is it is. It, I can't speak. Is it really kind of like you're an interior designer trying to figure out how to best use that space? Is that part of what you guys do? I would say so. Having been in a venue and a planner. I done that a lot in my own career, but I think just as a rental company, it also. Helps you figure out what else they need or from a rental standpoint, because a lot of times people don't realize they need an actual dance floor or they need an actual bar front. So it helps us let them know what else they might need in the tent. But yeah, it really is like interior design because also they might not know. If, if they're not using a planner or don't have a caterer, that's going to help them lay the, the floor plan out. They don't know how to lay it out. So they don't know what a general wedding tent setup was going to look like. So, yeah, it really is like interior design. Yeah. I also imagine. That it has to do similarly with it, with real space, with, you know, fire codes and things like that. Right. And we're exits I, how does, I don't even know how all that works Scott with in terms of like, Getting in and out accessibility is other thing that you guys have to look at. Yeah, that absolutely is. So when we serve a tense, We have to abide by. IFC or international fire codes. And that means we have to have a proper number of exits and we have to provide lit exit signs, fire extinguisher, normally just things to make sure that if you had an emergency, people could eat. Yes, the tent in a safe way. For most tents that are on private land that are private events, you don't actually need to get a permit. However, I will say for, for couples that are considering a more public venue, like at a state car or, you know, local park or. At a major venue. That's like downtown. If you are putting up a tent there, you do need to permit it. And. You will be checked to make sure that your install is following IFC guidelines. And that is another thing going back to booking, make sure you do that early because most municipalities are going to require at least 30 days to get that tent permit done. So another thing to encourage everyone to book, as soon as they can. Yeah, I love that. I love having stuff like. You know, nuggets like that to take away. Right. So if you're going to be doing that. Definitely having the time for the proper permits and things like that is good to know. There shouldn't be a last minute kind of decision in that way. Mallory in terms of, you know, ideal setup and obviously everything, you know, sizes and different, whatever. You know, we talk, you know, the Thursday set up. I mean, how long does it really take, just on average to set up a tent. You know, worst case. If we had to do it the night before, or day of. If we're talking just a tent and not everything that goes under the tent. Because that adds a lot of time. Yeah. I would say, you know, if you're doing a tent for 300 people, 30 by 50, say. Just the tent, maybe a couple of 10 accessories. Four to five hours. And it also depends on, you know, are you staking into asphalt that might take a little more time. Are you bringing in weighted blocks? That might take a little more time, so, you know, give and take a little bit, but. I would, yeah, that's kind of a general, if you're doing a big tent with all the accessories and all the rentals. It's almost a full day job sometimes. 12 Hour day. Multiple days. Depends. And when you guys are talking to accessories, like, are we talking like lights inside heaters, things like that. Those exist. Yeah. So attempt what you get as a tent rental, just the tent is a frame. At top. Steaks. If you're having a steak and the labor does set it up, everything else is extra. So you can have a clear, well, so if you wanted to clear top, it's going to be more expensive. If you want to Tidewater sail class style tent, that's going to be a little more expensive, different labor, different style of tent. But there's things like leg drapes, walls, doors. Heaters HVAC. Power. Flooring, all of that. Lighting lots of different chandelier's and lighting options. Tent liners. Yeah. You know, I mean, most rental companies have a lot of different things to enhance your tent, to be as sophisticated as you want. And then there's some people who they just want the frame and they just want it really for coverage or as a rain plan. Scott. Do you have anything to add to that? I think Mallory is on point with all of that and trying to say like tents generally take four hours is almost impossible just because Ted's come in every size imaginable and have so many accessories. And I think it just goes back to that each. Wedding tent set up is really unique. Just like the couple. And you really want to make sure that you do a site check in advance and talk about all those options that you might want. Because it may drastically change the amount of time that the tech company needs to set it up. When we're talking about, you know, low, then you guys are talking about weights, you know, things like that. Yeah. Obviously, if it's an established venue, maybe you guys have been there before and maybe they're set up a little more for, you know, load in and things like that. If I have a private residence, you know, Like Dorothy and I are going to have a tenant here in our yard. How does that work with the logistics of being able to load in? I imagine it's not this small. Right. I have no idea. Email or what is that? Yeah, I have no idea. Yeah. I mean, traditionally, what you're going to see is a 26 foot box strep shell up to your residence. So a site visit again, is great for can a truck fit here. Do we need to bring multiple small trucks? You know, do we have to back down the driveway? Are we going? I mean, there's been plenty of places in. Like Medina or Mercer island, where you have a tiny little path next to this house. And there's a tree branch. It's five feet. Clarence. And so knowing all those extra things, so you can prep the team beforehand to know, okay, you're actually going to be here for two extra hours because of how much you have. Gonna go back and forth. And I think to learn a lot of things. If you do have to bring weights, that's, that's some heavy stuff. So if you're having to go downstairs, You need to make sure you have strongest people on your team to be able to bring those back and forth. And sometimes there may be. Very rarely, but there may be some points where like, I can't. Put this here, like there's a, there's a place I went to one time that only had like a dumbwaiter and they wanted to put a tent on like the fourth floor and had to be weighted. That's a lot of, 100 pound weights to go up and down. So, you know, we offered that option. But you just have, there's just things that as a rental company, you figure out, okay, I can't do this, but what else can I do to make it work? Are you guys in, in this. I don't know or not where you guys are, are maybe more on the front end, right. Where you're talking with the clients and, you know, selling the things is Scott, you know, I mean your own. Well, I do. Liability. Except like having to actually like figure out like the weights and all of that. Is that something you guys do? Or is there like a engineer that does that to figure it out, all that sort of stuff? Do you want me to say that? Yeah, sure. So. What we are provided. So we all buy our tents. From a tent manufacturer and actually court and us, we use the same manufacturer for most of our tents. But just as tech tents, what they provide us is the, the amount of hold-down capacity we have to provide per leg. To safely install the tent. And we actually, both companies are internally deciding how much weight we're actually putting per leg because 10 manufacturers don't really design tense to be. Anchored with Balas or weights. They designed them for steaks. So that is. There's there's it is complicated. Engineers do get involved. Kind of the typical rule of thumb in our industry is 10 pounds per square foot. But it does vary. And we certainly look at things like. A couple getting married in the middle of August. How likely is it that they're actually going to have a wind storm during their events? And we'll make sure that we provide. A balanced solution that pulse. Incorporates the budget and the safety and science, you know, Good point. Where we're making sure the tent is safe, but also we're not making the cut. The call and pay for a winter storm. Grade 10 in the middle of August. Is. I guess I would never think about, and I obviously, you guys. So the experts, but you know, depending on like you were saying the land and if it's grass or gravel or asphalt, I mean, obviously you guys. Can accommodate all of that. Is that something that. I need to worry about, or just know that you guys, and I'll ask Mallory that, you know, do I just trust that you guys know what you're going to be doing? It's like if I'm hiring a DJ, I don't have to worry about how many speakers for the size of the room that I just trust them. You guys handle all that. I mean, I would hope that you would trust us to do that. And I would say. I guess either of our companies, I feel like you should be able to trust, but I also would tell any client, ask us those questions. If it makes you feel more comfortable, I'm the kind of person who's going to ask a lot of questions. I don't know if I'm renting something, any like a car. I. I don't have a question about something I'm just going to ask, even if I think that they're a trustworthy company. Scott. Do you have anything to add? No. I, I, I think that that covers it make, make sure your tenting company knows what they're doing. Make sure they're there. Certified rental company. Yeah, exactly. That they're following industry best practice. If they can't give you some sort of formula for how they're calculating. You know, weight or any other safety factor. That might indicate to you that they're not quite sure what they're doing. So one thing I wanted to ask about is, I guess, Deciding if you need a tent or not in terms of like weather and stuff. So I remember, so we, Dorothy and I got married down at Salty's and I think when we got married there, they had like an option that they could. There was something, you know, they had it's like, you could just pay. Whatever it was, it was set for that size or whatever. But we had to know, like, I think they said 10 days before or something because they, you know, to add that on and do whatever. You know, if I'm getting married in August and I'm worried about the rain, but I don't want a tat, but if we have to have a tent kind of deal. I guess we'll go to Scott first. How does that work? You are we reserving something? Is there a drop dead day out? How does all that work? If we, if we don't want a tamp, but we, you know, might have to have one. Sure. So kind of the rain insurance plan is what you're talking about and it's. Most tenting companies do have some sort of reservation policy just because there is a lot of labor and planning to go to the salmon to setting up these tents. I mean, what we do is really like, like construction and we have. To have people that are knowledgeable. But you know how to set things. These things up on staff and on hand for your event. So most companies are on like a two week cancellation policy. So that should give you enough. Time to really say, okay, do we sync. Whether it's going to be nice enough that we want to forgo this town or not. We certainly win. Clients decide to cancel within that two weeks, you know, we'll try to cut it down. Based on the labor that we're not having to do anymore. But we still, as a, as a company and as an industry, we have to have recoup some of that cost of reserving items. So know that. There is some costs to trying to just have a rate plan. Yeah, Mallory. I saw you kind of light up with that. Either of those two, what are your thoughts on this? I think Scott said it correctly. When he said it's a rain insurance plan. It is the best insurance that you can get, especially when you're getting married in the Pacific Northwest, because. I mean, there have been so many days where we sit in the office on Monday and this. The rain says it's gonna, or the weather says it's gonna rain on Saturday and we get. Dozens of calls. Can I get our tent for this weekend? And sometimes. We can't just sheerly because operationally we're already so busy. You know, Obviously, we don't like to do that, but there's just times when you just don't have the capacity to do it. You know, sometimes people are really flexible, but if you're at a venue where you have to be in the same day and out the next day, you just might not be able to do it. So it really is the best insurance. A couple can get for their wedding. If they know they're going to be outside, if you don't have an option to go inside, you really do need a tent. No, I a hundred percent agree with that. Yeah, it was Scott. Yeah. Add onto that. And I'll get my thoughts because you're obviously know more about. I agree completely. Don't don't take the risk if you're at an outdoor, but then you you're going to need. A rain option because you don't want to be the one who caused grandma to sit outside in a Sunder storm. With nothing covering her or worse on 110 degree or 105 degree day we're in Washington and people are just baking in the sun. I've been at a couple of weddings. Where people didn't get tense and you know, they're holding napkins above their heads. For shade. You have to think that there's more than just, you know, the. The once in a decade storm that might cause your wedding to be a little bit of a disaster without some sort of. Coverage. Yeah. A lot of people do forget about grandma and how hot it can get. It's very true. Was that I guess I, yeah. To segue to that. Obviously people think about rain when it comes to tents, but obviously you guys were talking about heat and stuff. I mean, it doesn't even need to be that hot, right. I mean, we're joking, but like, you know, it could be 80 degrees and you're really, you know, to be sitting out there for an hour. Do you guys find as many calls for that? Or how does that when people are worried about. Yeah, inclement weather, I guess they call it. I think the people who are worried about it being sunny are the people who know they want a tent. I think the people who are worried about it being rainy are the people who are like, well, I don't read it. Should I book it? Do I need to do it now. It really. Aye, Scott. I feel like you might feel the same way, but I feel like that's really going to be how people. People's idea of what they should get a tent for is really kind of how it goes. Scott thoughts on that. Yeah. I, I agree. I think. You know, just going back to what we were saying. You really need to think about all types of weather. It's not just rain. There's potentially lots of heat. And. Think about that also with like the style of 10th street. Like you might really want to clear top, but putting that up in the middle of August. You're going to want a lot of fans and you're going to need cooling to go along with the tent. Next case, which is going to add to your costs. And maybe it makes more sense to do a white tent in that circumstance. Certainly both our companies can accommodate either way. But you're also kind of putting up a green house. If you're getting that clear temps. And you want to make sure the homeowner knows that. The grass might die a little bit. Yep. What do you mean? So if you put a clear top. And it's over a beautiful line and it's up for three or four days. And it's 80 degrees. It could burn some grass. So, and I mean, clear tents are stunning. They are one of my favorite kinds of tens. So you can make them look so beautiful, but I do always preface. That potential. Cause you don't, you know, as a rental company, you don't want someone to come back and be like, you burned my line and you're. Well, it's the greenhouse. Yeah. And also it'd be a lot hotter like Scott was saying with the clear top. You know, it just that, at that point, we're just, we're trying to maximize light, keep rain out, but not. Yeah, it's actually worse than not having a tent at that point, because that clear fabric is letting all that. Light energy. And then holding that hot air again. So it's, it's much worse. I've seen it where like you put up a clear 10 on a lawn. And you'll actually cause all the water vapor in the lot too. To evaporate, which then hits the tent top. SOGs it. And so you just have this. Very hot. Moist humid. Interior event space. So try to avoid that. It's part of your molecular biology that, you know yeah. My science backgrounds. I mean, do you guys. I mean, it's obviously client choice, but do you try to talk people out of the clear temp ban? Because I'm just thinking from a, you know, video photo perspective, you know, having that clear tent is obviously going to feel a lot more open than let in more light. But it seems like there's a lot more downsides. Am I wrong? Scott. I mean, I don't think it's really talking them out of it. I think it's more of just making them knowledgeable of what they're renting. So it's the same as in the winter time, you know, it could snow, it could be icy and just letting them know all of the things about how a tent is going to react in different weather situations and their responsibility. As the renter. You know, if it does rain, if it does snow. Now, if it is really hot in there, just making them aware of. It because they don't, clients don't know what they don't know about tents and we do. And that's what we're here for. So I wouldn't say it's talking them out of it. It's just making them as knowledgeable as possible. Yeah, I would, I wouldn't talk anyone out of it's their top. Cause it's like Mallory, I'll select their tops and I think they're gorgeous sense. They're really fun to decorate and they can. Really bring out the Seattle skyline. That's it. I think there's ways to mitigate the problems around them. Like making sure you're ordering stands. If you're thinking that you want to clear top on a hot day or even full HVAC. You can also do things like instead of doing your entire tent clear, you do like select panels, clear our tents are modular and you don't actually have to have just a top that's entirely clear or entirely white. We can. Do your panels in certain positions? Right over where your ceremony is going to be. Is that clear top? So you get that look for those. You know, stunning photos, but then you do have a white panel for over grandma. Like we were talking about before, so she's not burning to death while you're getting married. There's there's always options. And I think it's just going in knowing that. These tents really, we can customize them. To your event needs and the logistical needs. Of what's going on. I don't want to say anything. I have to iron. I know this is a dumb question or whatever. So when it comes to like, if I'm getting married at a venue, right. And I assume like the venues got some insurance, right. Wedding insurance, things like that. If I'm getting married, I, if we're doing. In our house. That comes if it does rain, if it collapses, if the wind blows, whatever is that, do I need to have insurance? And this might be. A bigger discussion for you to tell me, stop me if I'm whatever, or is that come with the tent or how does that work? If God forbid something horrible happened in the tent, something happened to it. Does that make sense? My question. Yeah. Do you want me to. Okay, so you should definitely get event insurance. If you're hosting a big events. I recommend that. Beyond just a tent collapsing, you know, someone can slip and break their arm at your events. And. You know, Family and it can be only so close sometimes. Don't don't think they won't Sue you just because they're family. I've heard that story many times. If your tent falls down during your event, your tent company has done something very wrong. Is the first thing I will say. I, I have been doing this pretty much my whole life. You know about. 20 Years now, setting up tents and I have never seen a tent collapsed at a wedding. So I think your best insurance in regards to the tents is making sure that you are booking. Thing with a reputable company that knows what they're doing. You know, it's it's. I think one thing you will need to have with your tent company is a disaster evacuation plan. So if. The weather really did turn and we're talking. A storm where we're getting like 50 miles per hour. Plus wins. Then you're going to want to be considering. Evacuating and not posting your event that day or moving indoors. Tents are designed to protect you. From things like rain. And the sun, they are not inclement weather shelter, which means. Do not seek. Two. You know, shelter from a major storm in them. Valerie, anything to add. I think what Scott said is correct. And he's right on the money there. I mean, I've had people ask, what do I do if it's a lightning storm? And I'm like, well, you're going to metal frame. So please. Acuate. So I think our company has kind of just, here are all the things that you should do in different weather situations that we supply to people, especially if we know that the weather's bad, I mean, this. Scott, I'm sure your company was the same with, during COVID and having like restaurant tents and different tents and stuff up. Constantly. It's a snow. It's going to be icy. So I think. Reputable rental company is going to make sure that there is a plan in place and that you're aware of. Something that could happen. And how to handle it. Is that a concern with people find using the right companies and using reputable ones. And I've heard you guys talk about that, right. And that's a valid. Concern, you know, I deal with Al the time, but like videographers, you know, running off or do whatever. I mean, are people really, are there companies that are not properly equipped or are selling things that they shouldn't be when it comes to this sort of thing? Mallory? I mean, I'm sure that there are, I know we work a lot in partnership or in collaboration with other larger companies in the Pacific Northwest. And across the nation, really. And so, I mean, the ones that I know that we talk to are definitely pretty well and up there, but I know that there are little smaller companies that I'm sure that they're great as well. I just don't, I may not know personally what they're. Background is. So I think it's just like really looking at. You know, What their history is like having communication with people. Who've worked with them in the past to really truly, you know, say if they're a reputable company. Got anything to add. Yeah. I mean, check Google reviews, obviously for reputable companies. You know, I'm not going to out any company on Sierra, for instance. But there, there certainly are some companies. That simply don't have the knowledge of how to safely set up tents and set them up. So I think it goes back to, you know, talk with your rental company and make sure they're asking these questions of you. If they're not. You know, educating you on any of the things you've heard on this podcast. Then that's kind of a red flag. They're not thinking about. The safety of your events. Is there, do we have to do like a, is there a damage deposits and things like that when it comes, when you guys are setting up and how does that work? If we're like hosting the, like on our private land or versus a venue? I mean, does that change anything like, do we have to pay a retainer or if something gets damaged or how does that work? So most companies in the industry and I. I'll speak mine and court. So Alexander Park. In court, we both charge a damage waiver fee, which covers kind of the typical wear and tear and damages that happen in events. Things like an accidentally dropped glass. When it comes to tents, it would be like, The tent wall getting damaged because it. You know, was put too close to something or slaps. Started to shred. The only things that, that doesn't cover is things like fast. Gross negligence. Like someone went and untied our tents in the middle of the event. And a cover damage at that point. What's another one or vandalism. That would almost be vandalism in that case. And it's not insurance, just to be clear, the damage waiver that we offer. We're not an insurance company. We can't sell insurance. It is there solely as. A buffer between you and a damage. That could be a lot greater. That charge. Malheur, anything to add on that? Nope. That's exactly right. And I've seen the damage waiver be so incredibly helpful for people before. And a lot of times, I mean, we obviously do more than tense, but sometimes you don't know when a waiter is going to drop. 300 Gold rim champion fleet. And then the problem, because you didn't do the damage waiver. So I just seen it. Incredibly helpful because you have no idea what's going to happen at your event. Cause you're not the only one there. Yeah. I mean, I can just see, especially if you had to leave something overnight, then you maybe you've got families. If. I'm just thinking all these private event things and people are setting up and, you know, a candle burn something, or I don't, you know what I mean? I just, I always think of this and here you've left this immaculate expensive tent, you know, on someone's property somewhere. And it's like, Lord knows what's going to happen to that. You know, I do. So I'm always kind of curious how that works out. I want to. Go back to the, to the rain stuff a little bit. Cause we, we started derailing on that. Is there anything else specifically that we want to make sure we touch on today that I haven't asked about yet? Yeah, I would say. Another thing that some people should consider, especially if it's give. If you, if it's during the rainy season, so like April. March. I mean really may June. But if you have a tent and it has walls, You can still get rain going underneath the wall. So do you need to have a floor? Are you on some sort of property that might get soggy when it's rainy? We've seen, we've seen people have to add floor last minute. Because it was a downpour. And so adding that layer of just a little more protection, really, because a wall is made of canvas. Well, PVC different materials. Not it's actually like a canvas bag, but we call it classic. Yeah. Plastic, but you know, and it doesn't go all, it goes all the way to the ground, but water's going to get through, it's not a wall. Some of the tents that my company owns, we are able to do like hard walls and glass walls, but still, if you want the full benefits of being able to protect the ground and your guests adding a floor is a really great way to. Protect yourself. Safety. And it also just adds a nice. Upscale sophistication to attend as well. It really makes it a venue. Yeah, we'd have to imagine that it feels a lot more, even more so substantial than they are. Scott, anything to add on that? Yeah. I mean, I would definitely echo what Mallory said. Floors are essential for some. Events in our area, especially if you're trying to create a full venue in your backyard. And floors. Are their own. Animal. They're not, it's not just like there's one flooring option. Both our companies offer bolts. What's called a contour floor. So Florida is going to follow the slope of your backyard or whatever ground we're putting it on. Or a fully leveled option. Where we're actually creating, you know, a perfectly flat surface for you to host your event on. And there's a difference in price. There's a difference in labor. And they, they really will change the feel of your event from that backyard. A setting to all of a sudden you've erected. A temporary structure and venue in your backyard. So we, we get into what I think. We in the industry kind of refer to temporary structure rental at that point. And it's, it's a. A different animal. Yes, it is. Those are those you need multiple days. Yes. Yes, that is not a. Done in four hour job. Yeah, no, absolutely. That was kind of my cause when we were talking about the rain seven, obviously we're you guys are both larger scale anyway, but my, my question was, you know, we were talking about, you know, getting the tents and all that at the end of the day. Is it a problem with inventory or is it just having the time to set it up in the manpower or man, and woman power to set it up? I mean, is it. What. What, what is the issue when it comes to trying to add stuff last minute or do it, is it, is it sure? Purely, just like we don't have the time to put this together. It's normally manpower. Yeah. Our two companies, I would think, especially in season. We both have a lot of inventory when it comes to tense and, and both our companies, I think we'll pretty actively just order in another mid, if. We needed one to make sure that we could do an event. I think. You know, our areas just labor is. Is really hard to get and kind of go back to things we were touching on to begin with. Like this year labor is even more difficult and the demands on our companies. Even more intense. So we lost. Two. Competitors. This last year in wedding tents. Which means, you know, The companies that have survived. We're trying to do even more with the limited labor. So definitely book early. It's also specialized labor too. Like you have to really put the time and effort in. To learn how to erect these tents. Safely and you know, you can't just be hired one day and I mean, you can go train for a couple of weeks, but you can't be a lead on intent install if you've never done it before. Yeah. Is that. Cause I think we had talked at the beginning of how, you know, tens can be used right now to extend, you know, restaurants or whatever else, just to add more seating anyway. So there's just more demand right now across the board. Anyway, just cause you guys might have your inventory. Part of the other things, is that, am I saying that right? Scott. Yeah, I would say that. I mean, I think we're full with our companies. We're probably still waiting to see exactly what. It comes out during COVID. This has been a pretty crazy, you know, 12 months. Through our industry. But I think what we're seeing this year is it's just, there's, there's this huge backlog of weddings. We're going to happen in 2020. That have now moved to this year. And I mean, you're just seeing this with venues where they're booking, you know, not just Saturday and Sunday, they're booking Friday, Thursday as well. On events and the same thing is kind of happening with wedding tents. And I think the, the business that we are doing, which would be like more of the really big scale events, like festivals and corporate stuff, because very few people are trying to get 20,000 people together right now. Those normally require a different type of tent. Than a wedding tent. So I think there's going to be more of a crunch in this. Area. Mallory, anything to add to that? No, I think that's right. I mean, I have learned, I would say I don't own, my company has got this. He knows what is in his inventory, but I have learned like, Inventory wise, we have a lot more than I even realized. So we definitely have the capacity to do things, but having the people to do it is. Yeah, I could see, I guess that's a great point, you know? Yeah, maybe we're not doing the festivals right now, but it all needs a little scattered. Not little, but you know, smaller scattered ones and it's almost more work cause you're, you're trying to S you know, Send out all these different crews and stuff. Yeah, well, and I think two weddings I've seen a lot of people say, well, we were going to get married here, but now we're going to get married in my best. Friend's neighbor's backyard. And so there was a lot more demand to have that outdoor open air. But covered event this summer and it's like, July August, September. Everybody is like, well, you know, maybe not June, yet. I think things will go and be better by June. So there's still, people were pushing things. Because we're not quite there yet. Right. And October gets a little too rainy. There's like three months in 2021 where it's Scott and I are going to be. Not sleeping busy. There's two weeks of October to normally be okay. But yeah, I don't recommend waiting till like the Halloween time. There's some cold cold days then. It's going to be intense. Literally. That's my one tent joke for them. We made it. Without any tent buds. Ah, this has been great. We successfully. Navigated a, you know, almost hour long round table discussion about tense. I appreciate that you guys have done well. Anything else that, that I always asked the dummy read, isn't thinking about to ask. When it, when it relates to what's going on. I would say on top of also doing a site visit with your rental company is also visiting their showroom. Seeing what else they have. We bought, we, my company has two showrooms and I know Scott has a. Great. [Unknown] down in Kent. And so we're in Everett and Fife and just going and seeing what else you can do. And all the other things you can add to really enhance your event is a great way also to, you know, find out more about the company that you're going to be working with or the different companies that you're going to be. You know, Sometimes people use multiple rental companies for things. So I think, make sure you visit the showroom. I think that's great. I, especially too, because I mean, how do you visualize. You know any of that seven and then you can, you can see all the options, right? Like lights. Yeah. Stuff in different times, you could put your table together, your tabletop together. You can, you know, if you're meeting with a person that you're working on the tent with, you can sit and look at diagrams together and. Kind of make your whole event at that point as well. That's great. Scott, any, any other advice or suggestions? Yeah. I think we covered everything I had certainly stop by and see your show around. We'd love to see people again. People kind of say. Yeah. To show you what we can do in person, as opposed to just on sound. But otherwise just, yeah, thanks for having me. Well, I appreciate that. And I do, I think. One interesting thing about this podcast is to take things that people just take for granted, you know, I show up and it's, everything's ready to go. Right. And here, you know, all the work that goes into that in the questions and the time and everything else, I think is. I think it's important, you know, not only for couples, but also for other vendors that are in this, I know that we have both couples and vendors that listen. And so I think. Both sides can benefit from learning a lot more about, you know, each other's industries and things like that. So, I, if I've been Greg succeeded today, I needed to. Greg ladders. Let's do final goodbyes. I'll put everything in the, in the notes too, but Scott, if people want to learn more about you and your company and everything you offer, where would you have them go? I think to the website. Definitely. You know, it's the modern age. The website is going to have more information than anything we can provide. You know, I think email. The other thing that I would suggest you do is if you're planning on having a tentative events, Getting an idea of what you want. Before you call us, get an idea of the style you're looking for. You know, go on Pinterest and just see, see what's possible with tenants because they really are. Unique to each event. As I said, and unique to each couple, you can do a lot with them. Really your imagination. Is is the limits. So ask us what you're hoping to do, and I'm sure one of our companies can make it happen for you. And your website is Alexandra party rentals.com. Yes, it is. Perfect. Malheur. What about you? Yeah, I would echo what Scott said about. Knowing, having an idea of what you want for a tent. When you reach out to a rental company or, you know, working with your planner and figuring out what that vision is. But you can reach us at court, which is C O R T party rental.com. And then we're also core party rental across social media platforms too. So our Instagram and Facebook and all those things. All right. I really appreciate you guys coming on. I mean it, and I think this is good and helpful information, so hopefully we won't have a stunningly successful wedding season here coming up. We'll see. Hopefully we'll, we'll open up a lot and there'll be a lot more weddings.

Episode 35 (I Just Got Engaged, Now What? - Officiants)

Well, thank you guys all so much for coming on today. This is another one of our series of, I just got engaged now, what should I do? And we are talking about wedding officiants today. And so I've assembled some of my favorites here to talk about. If you're a recently engaged couple, you're wanting to hire in the fishy for your wedding. You know, what, what should you do when you're looking at? What questions should you ask? What information, what things, you know, do they want to know? It's been very insightful. We've done this with photo and video as well. Or a photo and DJ as well. And it's been fascinating. The things that I think would be important. Sometimes they're very different than what the, you know, the vendors want. So Chanel, why don't you introduce yourself? We'll go around and then we'll get into some of the talking points here. Yeah, for the cat crying. My name is Chanel Carlin, and I am based in Oakenoggen County. OMAP Washington, and I support couples who are wanting to elope. And also have a custom ceremony. That's just a really quick nutshell. One of the things that I think is really most important when couples are getting married is it's not just. It is about the celebration and it is about the party. So often they don't always know, at least when they come to me, that part of our job as officiant is to help them get legally married. And so to remember to ask about that and, you know, And making sure that they, that they're officiant actually is awareness. When did they come to a professional officiant? Who knows about that? Or someone. If it's a family member that there. I'm asking you to officiate for them, that they are aware of what they need to do as far as being legally married. Perfect. Yeah. And we'll, we'll, we'll touch on those points and make sure it's all on there too. I'm Ray. Ah, man, that needs no introductions, but we'll do it anyway. I'll let you introduce yourself. Hi everyone. I'm Reverend Ray van Wayne Cole. My company is Reverend Ray van Winkle and associates. We've been in the wedding business. 2003. Started with Jeff. The side hustle. Until 2008, where I went full time and then starting in 2012 or 13, I'm not that good with my dates. I started bringing in more. Associates into the, into the fold. We do. Wedding ceremonies, religious and secular. Interfaith multicultural. We performed some of the first same sex weddings in Washington state. And I've known. I've known Reid. I've known you for, I think probably as long as you've known me. And. No, we're going to raise a wifi. Just a little, a little staggered, their eye. Elaine. Why don't you go and tell us who you are. Hi. I'm Elaine and I'm still with Seattle wedding officiant. It's been a long time. I've changed things this past year, because I got a full-time job. I have benefits and a regular paycheck. So I'm downsized and I'm focusing almost exclusively on elopements in smaller weddings, as high as. I mean, I think I'm doing one at the Woodland park zoo this summer for 30 people. But I've. Kind of taken a different direction. And even though I downsized I'm as busy as ever, I'm doing elopements. Every weekend and keeping really, really busy, but I'm, I'm just really happy with. With my, my new career and the career that I continue as a Seattle wedding officiant. Yeah, and it's, it's great. It's been, you know, efficient it's of any kind, you know, Have luckily been able to continue to work kind of through all of this, you know, where there's, you know, some professions like, you know, DJs, it was really kind of hit or miss for a while. And luckily with the elopements and there. You know, working that way. So, I guess first off. You know, we we've talked a lot on here about different vendors. You know, we did the whole DJ thing. I thought the whole conversation with all be about music and everything else. Then it'd be a lot, a lot about finding the right personalities that you're looking for, right. That you want to find the right couples for you. I guess first off. And we'll go a lane and we'll, we'll circle back around. How do you, as an officiant, try to reach out and find ideal couples for you that you know, that you're going to meld with. And they're going to meld with you. Well, so I don't reach out. They reach out to me. But same, your question works for both of those scenarios. You know, since I've switched to elopements and small weddings only. One of the reasons I wanted to do that was because I wanted. To match with my couples more. And so. Beginning. I was taking everything, everything, everything, and now I am really looking for that. That good match and. You know, it's a lot of steps to get to that point because the first thing that happens is they fill out a contact form on my website. I get that information. I look at it and decide if I want to do it or not. That's the luxury that I have now. For example, I got an inquiry for 2022. They wanted to get married in February at five 30. On the beach by the lighthouse at discovery park. And I said, no. You know, because that's just too cold for this. So I kind of have that luxury now. And. But I brought to the scene, you know, personal touch and custom ceremony to my small weddings that I was doing for all my. And so I feel like. I am. Really looking at what they want. And. Can I give them what, what they want. And then from there, you know, we have a phone call and I get to know more about them and I've gotten pretty good at figuring out what I think is going to fit my brand. And hopefully meet their expectations. So, you know, I I'm all about, is it a good fit for me? These days, and this is the first year that I've been able to do that. And I really am happy. Really a lot, just really grooving in my music. Relation. That's great. Ray, you said someone that's, you know, so many weddings. How do you, how do you, I guess fine. What do you define as your IAA? Not ideal client now? But someone that, you know, you know, if they reach out, you know, that, that it's going to be a great relationship working back and forth with one of your couples. Yeah. Yeah, that's the, that's the, the personal connection thing. And first off the backtrack a little bit. Very much like a lanes situation. I don't really reach out to people per se. They come to me. Typically through the wedding planner or the venue, unlike earlier in my career where I was. Getting people from advertising and word of mouth and whatnot. The vast majority of the weddings. That we do now. Are from the wedding planner. So the wedding planner does. Harder that step. She says, Hey, I know you guys really well. I think I've got somebody you're really going to click with. And that's when we get together. When we do get together. Like in any interpersonal relationship you're looking for. Commonality things you have in common. There are a lot of ex Californians living in Washington, getting married. I'm an ex California. Myself. Lot of military people. I'm ex-military. A lot of people I deal with are Catholics or one of them's a Catholic. They're not getting married in the church. I was married in the church. My wife is Catholic or not. So I dodged the bullet there. No nutshell. Hopefully face to face. It hasn't been. Having a lot lately, but in that. In that consultation. Part of it is you're talking wedding business. What are you looking for in the ceremony? Who are your other vendors, et cetera. And then the other part though, is just getting to know each other. What's your story. This is my story. We find those commonalities and usually by the end of the initial consultation, everybody knows. Yeah. This is, this is good. This clicks or, yeah, I'll get back to you on it. And then still sometimes when people say, I'll get back to you on it, that doesn't necessarily mean you're out of the running. You see now, how do you, how do you manage that? You know, I think luckily I think for efficient, unlike maybe DJ where someone would say like, well, we're just. We just need someone to play music. But I do think that people feel like they want to have a big connection with their officiant. Right. Do you guys get what I'm saying? Like, you know, compared to like maybe, you know, not any demean, any, but like, I don't know if you need. BFS with your florist and that you, maybe you do with your efficient, just because of the day. How do you fall into that? Obviously you do the smaller allotments too, and things. How do you really work on building that relationship from the get-go? What Elena Ray has said. It's about that the connection is so much, and one of the things that happened is, so I do advertise. I also get referrals from other vendors. And then the auditor's offices actually I'm on lists with though. Then I get a lot of couples. The short-term weddings. Like within a week. Of their, their marriage. Coming to me. So then I'm kind of forced you very quickly. Build a relationship. That allows me the opportunity to get to know the couple. As much as possible. Within a short span of time. So really just. You know, as we all do because we're people, people, right. So you, you listen. You want them to talk about there? Their wedding and their vision. And the very first conversation that I'm having with my consultation is really just about, you know, congratulating them and celebrating their decision to get married and. And asking them to tell me whatever they want to tell me about their wedding vision and their plans, whatever that looks like. Even if it's not their ceremony, because so often they don't even know what their ceremony. Will be, could be or a vision for it, but they, they have the venue in mind or they want to talk about their relationship or, you know, who is going to come to the wedding or who's not. And it's just about letting them talk. Really and listening to what they have to say. And then, you know, kind of drawing the, the opportunity to ask them what they want to know from me. Before I start telling them what they need to know about an officiant and you know, what their ceremony could maybe look like if they wanted to work with me. So it's really just about listening and that's what officiant, I think. Really kind of specialized and we were really good at listening to what somebody wants and then kind of fitting in how we can help them achieve what they want. As part of their ceremony. Ray, when a couple reaches out to you. You know, Yeah, your contact form. You know, let's say it's a, it's a cold, you. It's not like a vendor era, like a wedding planner saying like, Hey, you know, Ray, this person's perfect for you. Are there, is there a certain things that are helpful? If a couple knows ahead of time? Just in terms of reaching out, you know, I get a lot of emails sometimes like, okay, we were going to have 250 people or whatever, like that doesn't affect me. Right. Is there certain information that couples. Have when they're, when they're beginning to look for the fish yet, you know, what type of ceremony or is that all stuff that you guys can figure out, you know, during the consultation. For the most part, that stuff we figured out during the consultation. I've got a very, very brief contact form. It's it's basically. You know, give me your name, your contact info. What's the date, time and location. Of the ceremony. And then. We take it from there, with my contacts. Back to them to set something up. It is. Kind of the Bible for me, because I think probably unlike. Chanel and Elaine, I don't know for show anymore, but I still do more than one ceremony a day when I can. And I get a lot of contacts where people say, this is the date. This is where we're getting married. But then I don't know if they've not set a time yet, or they're automatically assuming that I'm going to keep the entire day open. For them. So even just an ish, even if it's like a, we're thinking late afternoon, four to five ish, early evening, six to seven ish. This is going to be a brunch wedding. If people can be a little more. Just a little more thinking about what general time of day is ceremony. Is going to be, that's always really appreciated. I think that's a great piece of advice actually. To, to bring up, especially for efficients, where that is a possibility, right. One would assume like a videographer, you know, we're probably going to be there either. Oak of the day. I think that is a really great point. So yeah, if you're reaching out, because again, you know, I like to have what, you know, tangible takeaways from these discussions. So, you know, if you're talking to an officiant. You know, And again, some do some, you know, multiple or not, but I, it would be helpful just to realize that certain vendor types like maybe a forest or in the fishing, it would be, you know, booking multiples on the same day. And so having kind of a general timeframe. Elaine. Thoughts on that. And then any other information that they could provide ahead of time that's helpful or is that all? Just figure it out. No, my contact form actually tells me quite a bit. It gives me their basic contact information. The date. The time. Sometimes they don't have a location. And so that's what we're going to talk about in the consultation. And I have a lot of good ones up my sleeve. And, you know, I'm not doing more than one wedding a day, so it's pretty simple for me to be flexible. But knowing the time is really important. You know the date, if I'm free I'm I'm probably gonna. You know, Reach out, reach out, reach back out to them and talk about things. But so if I'm available on the day, then, then chances are pretty good. We're going to connect. But the time is also important. You know, those two things are probably the most important things for me. The venue is most of the time it's, it's, it's, you know, within an hour from here. And I'm good with that. I will travel. I go to Snoqualmie falls, like a lot. I'm up there. A lot and, but. You know, I'm kinda doing this loop around. You know, Anacortes. Snoqualmie falls. So, I mean, it's nice if they have a venue, but if they don't, I'm going to help them with that. Chanel is it. Do you. Yeah. I know, even when Dorothy and I got married, you know, we didn't really know ahead of time. Right? Like what we wanted that to look like. Did we want to have. Readings or, you know, things, whatever. I mean. Is that okay for couples to, to really not know that, you know, or when, when do you start like figuring that stuff out. Right? I mean, the, hopefully before. You know the wedding day, but I mean, when, when is that it, how much is appropriate to know ahead of time versus unknowns and shoot couples feel like, you know, not bad, but should they be like, wow, we really should know that. Or just, should they reach out to officiant and begin that conversation with them? I think absolutely reached out to your officiant or find inefficient to have that conversation with them. Most of the time, the couples that I'm working with don't they don't know that stuff. They don't have any idea. Very occasionally, occasionally you'll have a couple, that's really put a lot of thought into the ceremony. And that's not to say the ceremony is an important to most of the couples. It's just, they just don't know. They haven't been part of planning, a wedding ceremony before they might've been part of planning a wedding event for someone, but not generally the ceremony. So they really don't know that information. When a couple of books. You know, and again, because I have so many that are pretty short term in. And they, their, their ceremonies happen fairly quickly. I spend, I have a questionnaire that I send out to them. It's a wedding format questionnaire, and it asks for information. That will be on their marriage certificate so that I have all that information and I can verify the marriage certificate, but then I also start asking ideas about. You know, Their wedding itself and what vision they already have. And then I review that with them. In person or on the call. And then I start asking them more personal questions. And it's those personal questions that help them think about that a little bit more. And that's really where that starts, you know, their personalities, what they love about each other. What. Frustrates them about, you know, Each other, but also, you know, do they have favorite things that they really enjoy doing when they're together? What do they enjoy doing when their part, what do they enjoy doing? Do they have favorite songs? Do they have favorite movies? Have they thought about a reading. You know, what would that look like? You know, if they want a religious ceremony that, you know, brings in different readings and if they want a non-religious ceremony, I have a lot of couples who don't want any readings. So, you know, I really, I it's a conversation that they can have with they're efficient and they're efficient. We'll help them through all of that. They don't have to feel bad about anything, whether they've got their idea planned or not. There are many plans or not. The only way you got. Oh, I was going to see that most of the couples that I talk to has not even thought about their ceremony. So that's where us as professional associates come in. You know, like we are well-trained. You know, first and foremost, do you want religion? Okay. Non-religion I'm I'm. No nomination will minister. So. I can add religion, but the most. Most of the people that come to me, wanting religion. They'll often say we're not religious, but we're spiritual. So that gives me really. That's a lot of information right there for me. One of the things that I will ask my couples pretty frequently is. Have you ever, have you been to a wedding where you saw something that you really liked? You see that the converse. What I ask people. Is there ever anything you have seen. Yeah. Once we ensure is done or conversely is avoided. Yeah. You get the stories about the church pastor who starts talking about divorce statistics or the. Who was the grooms, the grooms best buddy. And he's saying stuff that's more appropriate to the toast. Then to the ceremony here. Like I've heard it more than once is they don't like it when the officiant makes a joke out of everything. And I couldn't do that if I tried, because I. Done the ceremonies for I've done, you know, 1300 ceremonies and I've kind of feel pretty comfortable with my spiel, but to make jokes is just not my thing. But, but funny things happen along the way and everyone. Laugh. But I really, I really enjoy talking about what options they have because there are so many options in a ceremony and. Another thing that. Couples will say. Is that, is that. No, we just want something really short and sweet. And, you know, I'll come in and I'll say, you know, just because it's short and sweet doesn't mean that it can't be elegant and lovely. And or have all the elements in the ceremony. Yeah, because I've done the really short and sweet ceremony and it just doesn't flow well. And so, you know, I'll tell them all their options. And so we really are educating. Couples on so many levels. And, and, and again, We're professionals. We see what needs to be filled in. We answer questions. I love questions personally. I wish somebody would ask me something that I don't know. I'm doing this for so long, right? We'll we'll we'll work on a question for you that Elaine. Oh, I would appreciate that. I've got one for you, Elaine. Oh, no. Live in the choice. Given the choice of you had to do one, would you do a sky diving wedding? A scuba diving wedding or a nudist wedding. Scuba diving. No I've had people. I've had people ask me that before and I tell them, and this is totally honest. That I can't swim. I hate Heights. Nobody wants to see this. Well, I see that. Adventurous one that I did was in kayaks on Lake union. Oh, cool. Yeah, we all rented kayaks from that Aqua. Verity restaurant. On Lake union. And I thought I was. Well, I got a single and it almost got called off because there were white caps on the Lake that day. They wanted to do a. W what's that lock and key. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, they wanted to do that out on the Lake. And so the boats are. Locking and, you know, Anyway. Yeah. Can you talk about the different options of things Chanel? Do you, do you find it. There is just more options. Now. I think people are so used to. You know, having the ceremonies back in the day, they're envisioning the hour-long. Catholic mass. Not that that's not, you know, wonderful too, but I think that people get maybe. Locked into that tradition. When there doesn't have to be anymore, right. We can make new traditions. So how do you broach that subject? Of creativity with your couples or how do they broach it with each other? You know, maybe it goes both ways. Yeah, well, they, they, most of the time when they come to me, they, the words short and simple or short and sweet. No more than 15 to 20 minutes. They were coming to me with that. And it's like, well, that's awesome. Because I would say the majority of my ceremonies are 15 to 20 minutes. That's not even an issue. But I tell them that's great. No problem. We can, we can do that. And then as far as, yeah, I, we, we talk about what that creativity, if you could have anything he wanted, what would it be? You know, where is, where are you planning to have your ceremony? And I have more and more couples that are coming to communities. These great places. Last October, I did one on sunrise at Mount Rainier. At sunrise. They were dressed to the nines. It was freezing cold, but you know, It was beautiful. It was. Absolutely beautiful. That's so gorgeous. And then we could take in their, their dreams and their, their relationship and tie that into their desire to have their ceremony on the mountain with their closest family. You know, and so as we talk about that, like who's going to be there. Why is it important that they're there? Why did you choose this place that you want to be married? What's important about that place. And actually just starting them thinking about. I have a couple that I'll be officiating for in September. They have nicknames for each other. And they actually took those nicknames and they, he painted the groom, painted their invitations, a custom invitation for each person. There's 10 people that are going to. Be at the wedding. And he took the characters, their nicknames, and made characters and hand painted their wedding invitations. And they wanted to share that with me because they want that incorporated into their ceremony. That sounds brilliant. I love that. It's those kinds of things. It's just through that conversation. Ray. I want to talk about, you know, when it comes to the, the ceremony, you know, we're, we're going through. We just did it a little bit on Saturday and the, I can't remember the efficiency. The script. He was very by the script, right? I've heard, I've heard this exact same thing a million times, which is not necessarily a bad thing, right. Because the couple has not right. They, they have. I knew that. Yeah. Yeah. We'll talk to everybody, but we'll start with Ray. You know, how do you balance that? Or how does that work are, you know, I know Chanel, right? I mean, are they all different? How did, how does that work in E. How do you put that together for the couple? Or what, what should they know ahead of time? About that. The way I run it and it's, it's similar to how some people do. But it's also different. I. At, at my price point for doing what. Things custom. Right. [Unknown] button, a ceremony book. I take the wedding ceremony, break it down into his 12 composite parts. And then for each segment or chapter is a word of the ceremony. I give you around 15 to 20 different options to choose from. So the mathematics is such that you are going to have, literally, I don't know if it's literal, but you're going to have cons of different variations. My book, however, is a tool that my couples use as much of, or as little love. Doesn't want. So I often times have people adding in. Their own material, maybe somebody doesn't like any of my ring exchanges. They go find something they like better. They incorporate it into my template. If I liked the contributions enough, I can. And then my buffer next year. So that keeps it up. Rolling. Type of situation very much. Like what Elaine touched in on earlier is I'm not a really jokey. Nothing. In my script. Stand up. Right. As for people. In LA and I know you've done the same and Chanel. I'm sure you have too. Is that invariably something goes wrong. Maybe he can't get that ring on her finger all the way. I'm going to say something. I can't, I can't help it. It's just the way I am. And I'm very, very good at that. You know, the humor that I'm injecting into the ceremony doesn't have to be scripted. It's going to be organic. And natural, depending on what happens. Every once in a while. I will have a couple who will say, just do exactly what we give you an don't vary and be very serious and stern and dramatic. For the most part, people don't want that these days they want lighthearted, humorous and celebrate. Tori. Well, it is, and it's, it's hard. Because ultimately you're still hiring, you know, the personality right. Of you guys, and it's the same. That we've done. You know, with the video and stuff. And, you know, I post go into wrestling stuff online and doing that. You know, podcasts. Because, you know, they're hiring us for who we are. Right. You know, Ray, I mean, you, you know, you're a solemn person when it needs to be, but you're also very funny. And so that people need to know that right. Going in, where if you want someone that's going to be, you know, No personality at all. That's great. And you can hire that, you know? That is something to keep in mind. Right. You know, is you're hiring that. Let's go to Chanel and then Tulane about, you know, I know you do a lot more custom riding with the, with the ceremonies. How does that work? And do you know, do they come in with ideas? Do you meld that? You know, what do they need to know? Sometimes they come in with ideas, not very often. So we have conversation and I send them, like I said, I have a questionnaire that I sent initially, and it just is really kind of give me a very basic idea of your vision. And then I review that with them. And then I have a pretty in depth conversation. With them again, their likes, their dislikes, what are their dreams? You know, what. What do they love about each other? What are some great stories that they have and that they want to share. And, and throughout that conversation, which takes. I spend about an hour, an hour and a half with them. I take a lot of notes. I kind of craft. Craft the story. And I craft a ceremony and then I draft it and I send it to them. And then I tell them whatever I think about your ceremony, because I don't send it until I'm confident with it and that I love it. And I think they're going to like it. But it's most important to me that they love it and that they feel it's their personality. And. This is their day. They can make whatever changes they want. It's only a starting point. And, and that's really what I want to get across to them is that this is a starting point for them. And while I've created a ceremony based on our conversations and what they shared with me, It's still their ceremony and their day and whatever they want is going to happen. Elaine. How do you, how do you approach that? Concocting all this together. Yeah. Concocting. All of it. I've got a, I've got a document that I've been working on since I began. It's kind of my labor of love. And it's about a 75 page document. That is broken down similar to res in the elements of my ceremony, my ceremony. It's traditional. We always start with a greeting and we always end with formal presentation. But what I provide is are dozens and dozens, dozens of options for the, for the couple to choose from for the greeting. For the reflections on marriage. Vows, unless they want to write their own personal vows and on and on. So I've never seen the same ceremony twice. It's remarkable because they have so many options, but we, that we work is that we collaborate. I send them the documents. I also have a reading. I have a religious readings file and a non-religious readings file, which is mostly. It's a great document. It's got readings in it. Everything from Shakespeare to excerpts from books like. Hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy and some earnest Hemingway. And so they get both of those documents and they cut and paste what resonates with them into a draft. And then it comes to me and I review it for flow and clarity. What I'm looking for are. Repeats. And my eyes really trained to catch that. And we just go back and forth until we get what they like. And. I'm not customizing a lot of my ceremonies now. I customized every single one of my large ceremonies, but the elopements not so much. I will personalize the greetings often. But if they want me to include something that's, that's, you know, particular to them, I'm more than I'm really flexible. I guess the, I guess the point is you have to be flexible. You provide a structure. And then you produce something. That is based on their wishes and might use all of my materials. They might bring in their own. But, but we collaborate. It's very much a collaboration. It's so interesting to listen to all you guys talk. And obviously everyone goes about it different ways. And even like with our videos, We're very formulaic in terms of I could have the same template every time of kind of generally. You know where things are going to go, but then, you know, the, the uniqueness of the day, right. Makes every single couple of feel I gets there. So it is interesting where like, you know, sometimes templates are cookie cutters or things like that, you know, sound weird, but like, it's almost just gives you the framework to put all that stuff in there. It's just really fascinating listening to all you guys talk about it. Cause obviously, you know, I don't make, you know, wedding ceremonies. Ray, did you ever read. Do me a favor read and don't use the phrase cookie cutter. Yeah. Because to me that implies. You've got one ceremony and you're putting name here, name here and that's it. So I'm a, I'm going to slap you a couple of times. No absolutely. And I, and I think that's, I think that's why we've all been successful because we provide a unique. Service that, you know, People who've worked with us have given us great reviews. And it's, you know, we're not paying anybody to do that. I always tell couples, you know what? I can talk about myself all day long. You want to hear what other people are seeing, go to these places and read my reviews. You know, so we work really hard for our couples, whether it's an elopement or. A large wedding. No absolutely. One thing I know Elaine's going to have off here pretty soon. I, one thing I wanted to get all your points about we'll start with Elaine and go around. Where you guys. As efficiency we did the DJ one, you know, people are really hiring you guys for who you are, right. Where like you could be a jerk photographer and still have great work and people. Right. But gender. I mean, he, I'm making, you know, light here bright. But efficient to me that more than anything else, right. It really is, you know, what you do, and then also who you are. So how do you, I guess, just thoughts on that, how do you approach that? I mean, I could formulate more of a question, but just, that's kind of where I'm going with that. So, Elaine, let's start with you and go. Yeah, I can answer that really easily. I am my genuine self. When I'm. With couples in that initial consultation, we're going to find similarities. I was born and raised in Seattle. You know, if people. Are from Seattle and their families are all from Seattle. I want to know where they lived, you know? We have so much in common, just based on that one fact. And. You know, I really wanna, I really wanna know about people. So I ask a lot of questions and that's just my genuine self. I'm always very curious and inquisitive about what other people are doing. You know, like I'll go to a party and ask somebody, what do you do for a living? You know, it's out of the wedding industry. And it's not because I'm trying to be arrogant it's because I really want to know what. Do I'm really curious about your life. And so being my genuine self. I have, I have to be honest, it doesn't win me every single couple. Because. There are some people who are older conservative, who don't really want to talk about themselves, you know, why would she ask that? But I'm still gonna do it because. I've been really successful and I'm still. A wedding efficient, efficient in business. And I'm really proud of. Of. Of who I am. You know, I'm really proud of who I am. And so that's what they're going to see. I'm not going to be some phony person anyway. That's that's my most. That's my superpower. Okay. Is being my genuine selves. It's great. Re how do you, how do you approach that? Yeah. Somewhat, somewhat similar being, I mean, if you're. And no matter what you're doing in life, if you're not being your true self, you're being false to yourself. And why are you doing this? In every type of job I've had in my life. And I've done lots of sales positions. In the past. You're not selling. A product you're selling yourself. And in our business now, our product is. Ourself. Most of the, the clients that I work with find that I am a. I say very funny. My wife says somewhat funny. A person. Somewhat irreverence the name Reverend I put in front of my name, but you could call me. The irreverent. I liked things. Pretty up on. All things, culture, role. And I find my super power. Is to be able to. In some forms greater or lesser, but with every single person I've met in my life, I find something in common. I can relate. I mean, I've, I've not yet met any politicians. Will be named. But I could probably find something in common with. Almost everybody. Yup. That's a good superpower. She now, how do you, how do you approach that? I think you're absolutely right. And people are hiring us. And they're hiring us for our personalities and for the connection that they feel. One of my couples last October. They found me. After their other officiant had had to back out of their, their wedding ceremony, about three weeks. Before. And so that's stressful. Right. And they already had the place. They were getting married in Easton and they had a cabin and they had people coming and, and she was like, can you be there? Can you be there? And I'm like, Yeah, I'll be there. Of course. There will. And she told me. After the wedding that she was very nervous, even just up in town, she actually just arrived. Up to where her. To where her fiance was standing, waiting for her. And. And, you know, I was just looking at her and she's just this beautiful bride, but she was really nervous. And so my job right then, and there is. I feel like to help her calm down. Just to breathe and she get them. Just to help her breathe and we don't start the ceremony until they're ready and they're breathing. And then we do the ceremony and in the photos afterwards, she was so impressed. And she said, I could tell she was not only did I feel more calm when I, when I saw you just there. You were just radiating this love and this desire for us. To enjoy our day. That's great. She said, that's really what it was about. I could tell you love what you do. I love what I do. I get to celebrate people who are in love. Or wanting to be married. You know what. What else could there be? That's better than that for me. I mean, there, there wouldn't be, but that's really, it. That's who they're hiring. They're hiring. Us as a people and people who love to celebrate other people. That's a great answer. And I know we, you talked at the beginning of the, about, you know, the legalities, you know, making sure it's all, whatever. And I guess that's a great segue into, you know, you had said they had someone that, you know, that flagged the bailed out. You know, Are across any vendor type. You're going to get people there trying to cost, save, and E have a friend do add, or have whatever do it. I guess here. Here's we'll go back around, you know, Emily, and if you need to hop off. You know, don't when you need to get for your meeting. But I want to hear your thoughts on that, about everyone's thoughts about, you know, hiring someone, you know? Yes. It's more expensive than, you know, having someone do it, you know, off Craigslist or whatever, but. But the, the things that go along with that right there, dependability, and then obviously making sure everything's done legally and whatever Chanel do you have thoughts on that? And then we'll go around. Absolutely. You know, I have an agreement with my couples and that agreement says, you know how we'll communicate with one another, but there. Mostly it's that I will be there for them. And unless something dramatic, like, you know, the world falls apart and things have to be canceled. Or I'm in an accident and I can't actually physically get there. I will do everything in my power to be there. I will find somebody who can be. That they need to be able to have that to count on. It's so stressful to plan a wedding. And if you don't know that you can count on that person. You know, You know, why do you want to have that stress? So that's why professionals are really, really key that they're going to actually be there. And they're going to know what they're doing. What are your thoughts on that? Other than, yeah. Making sure that everything's done legally. I mean, if anything. Yeah. Well, yeah. To me, it falls into three main categories. Number one. Chanel you picked up on, is it you're paying a professional because a professional is going to be there. The second reason you're paying the professional. Is because the professional is going to be able to present the ceremony. The way you want it. Your guests are going to be able to hear what you're saying. The rain's not going to get fumbled. The officiant is not going to forget to ask everyone to be seated after the bride comes down the aisle. That's a big, and then number three, number three is you can guarantee that you will actually be legally married. It's not, it's not that much of a problem when you have a professional wedding planner, because every wedding planner, rhino post hates dealing with amateur officiant, because they've got. Kind of them and make sure they filled all the paperwork out properly. Most planners. I know tell me that when they get to the rehearsal, for example, The do it yourself efficient. We'll just turn to the planner. Okay. What do I do now? When they're performing the ceremony at the end of the ceremony. Are they. Sign the documents. They forget there are documents. They didn't ask the bride and groom. Have you got your documents? Before the ceremony or the dates. Good. So. Involved in it. Elaine thoughts on that before you got to hop off. Yeah. Everything that motional and Ray are seeing is really true. And. You know, I've had. Venues that I've worked at quite a bit I'm on their preferred vendor list or whatever, and I've had. Representative. You know, I'll walk in and they'll just say, Oh yeah, We're so glad it's you. We know everything will be taken. And that's a really good feeling for me. I mean, Get tired of hearing that redo. It makes me feel really good. But yeah, I mean, we know the timing. We. We know that. Ask people to rise. When the bride walks in, we also know to ask people to sit when, you know, she gets up front. And as far as the marriage people where it goes. Yeah. I mean, that's really an important piece because if you don't get that right, it's. Back out. By the auditors and either goes to the it's supposed to come back to the officiant, but sometimes it goes to the client and they're all freaked out. So. One thing that I do insist on is privacy. When we fill out the paperwork, the paperwork, because. You know, mistakes happen and the more privacy that we have. I squared to ensure that the document is going to be completed correctly. You know, we, we just. But to ask, we know what to do. We know how to provide an exceptional service for our couples. Perfect. No, I have to go. Yeah. Because I have to hop into another meeting. Perfect. We'll see you. Thank you so much. Needed there accidentally. Yeah. One, one last kind of a big question I have for, for both of you guys. And I guess we can start with three. Elaine had talked about. Yeah. A lot of people say nowadays, you know, we're spiritual, we're not religious. You know, we want to have some, you know, A sense of that. I want to talk about how do you guys both. When your ceremonies. Balance out where, you know, you still have the Reverend this, you know, there's some spirituality to it, but it still is kind of like hip and modern, right. Where it's not something these that make sense. Yeah. How do you approach that? Right? Well, yeah, well, yeah, the. The spiritual, but not religious. That's the new denomination. She could put up churches that say spiritual, but not religious. In regards to that. And again, this is, this is part and parcel of the, of the first consultation we do. Where. We find out if the couple. Once any religious content in the ceremony, or if they wish to stay away from that. The way I defined to my couples of religious ceremony is basically we have a prayer at the beginning. A benediction at the end. A mention of God every once in a while. Nothing heavy handed or over tile, honestly. Oh, we might've lost you there for a second. Chanel. Why don't you carry on? I'll meet Ray here. We'll get him back on. Okay. So I I'm the kind of the same. So there's a couple of things that I think are really funny. I get a lot of you. You know, we're, we're spiritual, but we're not religious. We don't go to church, you know? I'm like, okay, well, it's not a problem. Do you, do you want to invite God in or not in vitamins? And what does that look like? So, you know, and, and similar to what Ray was saying, you know, there's a, you know, if they want to have a blessing. You know, you can have a prayer or a blessing and a blessing. Doesn't have to be a prayer. And sometimes they don't even want to bless him. He just want to welcome their guests. And acknowledge and, and that's fine too. But I think one of the things that comes across as I'm always. I always let couples know that they are honoring me. By allowing me to officiate and their guests are honoring them by, by being there. But a ceremony, a wedding ceremony is sacred. So whether it's religious non-religious non-denominational. It's a very intimate. Personal commitment. And so I think it's one of the things that I talk with them about is the sacredness of that. And we still have a hip. We can still have it, modern will have their readings, their music, whatever, but it's still, they're taking time to actually commit. To another person instead, then we talk about that. That sacred. Where we lost you for a minute there, I finished your thoughts. You said. Included. Yeah, isn't. So I mentioned the God. Incorporating some of the things is how do you keep the spirituality with, with the modern wedding ceremonies? Yeah, boy. That is an interesting question. How do you keep the spirituality? You know, it's. Boy. I don't know quite how to, how to put this. I don't know that I've ever had anybody ask me. No. Let's do it again. No. Okay, well, I'll just end up. I'll edit this year at the end. We'll just all remind myself. We'll chop this off. Still has a spiritual component. Hey. We lost you there for me. I'm just going to cut out here. I'll I'll cut this part out. We'll all splices together. So, so go forward again with that. Well, just to backtrack a little bit. By virtue of what we're doing is. The cervical. Ponant to it. And even the verbiage that we use that has no overtly religious content is still spiritual in nature. If it was not as spiritual in nature. It'd be a courthouse wedding. You take her? I do. Do you take him? I do. Boom. You're married. So just by, by the sheer, in this of bringing in everybody and all the other components of it, it, it, it still helps exactly. Just people, people gathering together to do something in common is spiritual. When we God willing or able to. Yeah, that's the sacred, that's the part that, that's that sacredness again? That. That's what I was Jerry. I'm just jumping in here race. So whenever you come back, you can do that again. But that's that piece that, that sacred you. The coming together. However many are there. With the couple it's just about being there and love and supporting them and witnessing their commitment. To each other, that in itself, It's spiritual, it's sacred and it kind of there, I use those terms. Slightly interchangeably. Perfect. Or we're, we're going to get out. I'll I'll clean up the end of this year. We had a little bit of wifi issues here. We've lost her now. Chanel. It's just us. Well, We'll let me, let me do this here. And we're going to that. There we go. I'll just lock the room. We'll finish up here. I Chanel. Any, any other glaring issues? Elaine dropped off for her meeting and then raise internet diets. And now we are the last standing. Anything else that you would have couples want to know or think about before we, before we hop off this before zoom in floods altogether. You know, For my perspective. Usually with my internet. Doesn't walkie. So I'm glad it's somebody else's. But it's their wedding. It's their wedding day. As a professional officiant, we are going to listen to them and create a ceremony that's really, really special for them. Right. They get to choose and they get to say that it, you know what they want to have happen. There's not going to be somebody else's day. It's all about them on that day. And I think that's what people just need. Your remember. Perfect. Ray, any final thoughts? We're we're gonna, we're gonna bail here with zoom and wifi and everything. Any followups? Yeah, my, my takeaway has always been that without the affair. And it's just a really expensive. Party. Without be efficient. It's it's a really expensive part. Yeah. Like that. Well for, for Elaine. I know she was thrilled to be on. And for both of you guys too, thank you so much. You just, you know, it's so interesting to hear every different vendor type and kind of what, they're, what they're looking for, what, you know, what they want a couple cent know what they want, you know, the couples to ask. And so I appreciate you guys sharing your expertise and I'll make sure to put everyone's information and everything on there. So. Thank you guys all so much again. We’ll be back next time.

Episode 34 - Working Through Divorce

Well, I'll tell you when, when Rebecca Grant emails, you and says, I have an idea for a podcast and I want to come on, you know, we certainly set up the time and we get under this discussion. I'm so thankful today that you felt comfortable enough to reach out and also. Just inspired enough. You know, to, you know, want to come on and, and discuss and talk about, you know, kind of a heavy subject, you know, talking about divorce in weddings and in grief. And in general, I just have that in the incredible, get to know your wedding pro yesterday with Ernesto, Laura, he's a big wedding DJ out of the Yakima. And he had almost lost his business this year was transitioning to doing like drive-in movie things outside. There's a way to. You know, and, but he was sad. He was like, I was a week away from losing my business. Right. And so, you know, the stress is real. The grief is real. There's a lot of things going on. So. We're talking about a divorce and kind of handling that and everything else in weddings and grief and all that. So I, Rebecca, why don't you introduce yourself? And we'll kind of get into this and see where we go. Everyone. Good to see you again. I'm Rebecca Grant. I'm I'm the owner of new creations, wedding planning based out of Kirkland. And I'm the owner of twin Marlow gardens wedding venue out of Snohomish, along with my husband, Brian. And I'm also the vice president for weapons, Seattle, which is wedding international professional association. And I'm also one of the founding members of w S w E a, which is wedding Washington, state wedding, and events, advocates fighting for the safe reopen. Of weddings here in Washington. Yeah, and absolutely. I was going to say with that as well. You know, literally they had just gotten off of immediate call talking about those things in advocating those things. So very in tune with everything going on and, and, you know, certainly at the forefront of, of a lot of different steps. So. I guess what. What inspired you? You know, we reached out last week. He said, you know, this seems like a really pressing thing right now. I'm seeing this a lot online. What was the inspiration to talk about, you know, handling divorce and things like that in weddings. Yeah. So I know this is a little bit heavier topic than what we typically talk about, but what I was noticing is just, you know, being a part of several Facebook forums specific to the wedding industry. Online. I was noticing that a lot of conversations were coming up across the country of wedding vendors that were really struggling. Obviously last year was a really incredibly stressful year and it brought everything. Bubbled up in terms of things that possibly might not have been working well in your relationship already. It just exponentially added to that stress. And a lot of couples didn't make it. And. I was seeing that people were really, really struggling. With, how do I juggle the excitement for my couples and the excitement for guiding them through? A marriage that you certainly hope last until the end of end of your days. As you're going through this incredibly sad and stressful and sometimes embarrassing. Phase in your life, you know, and I just realized having been through a divorce myself, that this is not talked about very much, and I was that person, you know, back in 2008, my ex-husband came out as gay. I was married to him for almost eight years. We got married in 2000 and I. I was embarrassed. I was alone. At the time I was living in Hawaii and I was working as a wedding planner on a law. And here, I'm trying to keep that life afloat of supporting my couples and being excited for them as I'm going through this devastating loss myself. You know, my ex-husband was somebody that I have known. Since my freshman year of high school, I. We dated for many years, I felt like I knew him inside and out. And to have him come out as gay was like life altering. I mean, it just flipped my world upside down and especially having. You know, lived in Hawaii when I was going through all this. And my family was back here in Seattle. I just felt totally alone. And I do specifically like remember going to grocery stores and to restaurants just so I could be around people. And just so I could feel somewhat alive, you know, I mean, I just felt like I had no one to turn to. I had no one to talk to and I just really empathize with people that are going through. This phase in this journey in their life that you are, you are not alone. I mean, I remember. Google searching. You know, X has, or husbands that come out as gay and like, am I alone in this? You know, and I know my situation is a little bit different than what a lot of couples go through, but I think regardless of your specific circumstance, the loneliness is real and it's something that needs to be talked about. Yeah, it's hard because you know, Weddings in general are different where, you know, when we show up. You know, you really are on from, you know, from the get-go. You know, it's, it's really this all consuming thing and you don't, you know, you don't really have a lot of time to process. Like other things that are going on, right. W w you know, obviously it's about the couple's day, but, you know, I mean, especially lately with, you know, dealing with the regulations, I know I've talked with Alan Chitlin a lot, you know, friend of the podcast about this too. Yeah, it was really hard just in general to be that, to be excited about weddings right now, just across the board, just, you know, What's allowed this week, what's going on, you know, I'm booking weddings for later this year. I'm like, is that going to happen? I don't know. And then to put on top of this, you know, trying to, trying to manage, like you said, what, what could be perceived as an embarrassing thing? Something maybe I think a lot of people look at it like, you know, they failed, right? Like I failed that. And so it is really hard. Right. I mean, am I, is that kind of where your. Similar thoughts about, about, not that we have to perform when we're vendors, but you are like, you can't show up and like have a crappy day when it's someone else's wedding. Right. 100% Even in even, you know, From a planner, you can't show up to planning meetings being disconnected. You have to be all in. You have to show up for your clients. They're hiring you to be the professional, to be that person that they can rely on to show up and be present and to be excited for them. And I mean, I remember wearing sunglasses to meetings because I was crying so hard, just a couple hours earlier that my eyes were so black, bloodshot, and so red and. Trying to be present for them when you're going through your own personal hell is incredibly challenging. And it's not just on the divorce side, you know, you, you brought up like last year. Going through. Basically overnight 90% of our income being wiped out overnight. You know, you're trying to juggle all my gosh. Here I am with my personal finances and my personal relationship. And do I need to get a, another job while managing all of your couples and trying to be supportive for them. And yes, I'm happy to reschedule your date. You know, when inside you're just dying. And so it's, it's very much of a, you don't want to feel like doctor you. Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde, but in a way that's, that's kind of the position that you're automatically put in, you know, and especially. Especially around divorce, you know, it's. When you're helping a couple get married and be excited about their wedding. You don't want them to see the could be right. Like you don't want them to see, this could be you. And however many years, you know, you, you want them. You want to be supportive that moving into this marriage is for a lifetime. And, you know, you truly go in thinking that it is, and, and that is certainly the hope. For all of us, but as, as a vendor, trying to be on that side of support and that side to show up and be present for them. It's incredibly challenging, too. B. The happy, that excited that, you know yeah, definitely get married. It's great. You know? Type of thing, because most of the time it is. But it's, it's just a weird position to be put in. And, you know, I know that a lot of us really strive to be authentic in our relationships with our couples. And I know that's such a buzzword right now. It's but it's, it's true. Like we don't do this job to become millionaires. Like none of us would have gone through this stress that we went through last year. If we were just in it for the money, we truly, really love our couples and want to be a part of their day. But. That life still happens, you know, things that you go through still happen. And I think it's. Opening opening kind of behind the scenes. Ever so slightly to just share with your couples of, Hey, this is what's going on. Whether it be a divorce, whether it be the death in the family, whether it be a health prognosis, or anything like that. But still letting them know I am here for you and I've got you. But I'm just going to be gone through a little bit of something else on the side, you know, so I don't think we need to be a full open book, but I think having that conversation with our couples is needed. It's hard because you know, like I've gone to wedding MBA a couple of times and that's, you know, the big like Vegas. You know, doing the business to do weddings and stuff. And that is their big thing is authenticity post online, you know, be yourself. You'll let you know, let your couple in, you know, your couples in and. You know, your other vendors and everything else. And, and so, you know, we want to do that, but like you said, then it is, it does come with. You know, not every day, like you're to get emails about, like you said, postponing or whatever, you know, we just had a cancellation yesterday, you know, 10 minutes later, I got to walk into a console. And, you know, I've, I've said for a while now with everything going on and either we have stuff going on in personal life too, is like, I am glad in some ways that best made videos is as established as it is now, because it would be, I couldn't even imagine trying to build a brand now, you know, or build a referral base now, you know, I mean, at least like some of that stuff is on autopilot, you know, going into whatever now, but. The other note I had on that is, you know, it is challenging. Like you said, when there, when there's things going on in your life and you're trying to put up, you know, a strong face that we, we have one of our cancellations last month. For the summer and their criticism, you know, that I had gotten back from them was they didn't feel like I checked in enough. Kind of in the interim, in, like, we kind of did like the big check-in, you know, last year with everything. Okay. We get rescheduled. Okay. Now, you know, it's like January. Okay. We're like six months out, you know, and that's on me too, but it's like, we need to have grace both ways there. Cause I'm like, I, you know, there could have been a lot of stuff going on, you know, where you're like. You're trying to, you know, manage 35 40, whatever weddings you're like, why didn't, you know, is that my fault? Like we were trying to win. When can I have time off, you know, I struggle with that with, you know, Being on emails and stuff. I know you do a really good job of like, you know, setting the boundaries of like, these are my days off. These are the days I'm responding because it's, it's hard to be on all the time, you know, when it comes to cause whenever your client is planning. Dad is when they want to plan and talk about their wedding and they don't really necessarily care, you know? What is going on for right and wrong. Right. For sure. Yeah. That's very true. I think that that was one of the biggest things that, and why I'm so adamant and really protecting my Sunday and Monday, weekend days off is because as, because of having gone through my divorce, And realizing, you know, that I needed that time to process just to be alone. If I needed to, to not get out of bed, if I needed to. And that was, that was, I think, kind of the start of it. So it started back in like 2008 of me just saying no, this time is mine. And that's the expectation from day one with my couples, even at the console, I remind them my days off are Sundays and Mondays, you will get my out of office. Feel free to do a brain dump. Totally fine,but know that I'm not going to get back to you until I am officially back in office. And I I've been really successful at that. You know, it's it, it's just the expectation from, from the start. And everybody understands that. So the other note I have when you were talking about, you know, having gone through and with the planning, that is always interesting to me too, when you know, we're with a couple and they're getting married and, you know, either one or both parents have been separated. And so they, you know, there always is that weird dichotomy too, of like, okay, what. Whether it be on here, like, okay, well this, you know, we're going to, or I mean, it's it's, but it's something, you know, we live with and it's, I mean, how do you, I mean, you deal a lot more with like managing families and stuff. I mean, is that ever like things that are talked about where. Okay, so feel free then. Yeah. So I actually, this is a question. I asked them that my initial consultations, I come right out and say, I want to know what I'm going to potentially be walking into on wedding day. So talk to me. Is there any family dynamics I need to be aware of? Are there any divorces in the family? Are there any deceased parents? Is there anything weird that I just should be 100% aware of prior to walking in on wedding day? And that does help me through the planning process to be able to specifically address. Okay. So when we're talking about you're speeding. Assignments for the ceremony. Specifically the front row where parents typically are in the seat of honor, right? What does that look like? Do we want to see mom and dad together, or are they going to kill each other, you know, and make it all about them and cause a little bit of an issue on wedding days. So these are conversations that. It's really easy to. Forget about it because the couples obviously living that life and going through it. You know, on their side, but it's really important for them to open up to their wedding vendors and say, Hey, you just should be aware of this dynamic. You know, especially it goes across all sectors, you know, photographers need to know. The family groupings and they rely on their couples a lot for knowing those combinations that need to be put together. So that there are no weird things, you know, and if it says particularly strenuous or fresh divorce in the family, photographers need to know, okay. Mom should not be put right after dad. Like let's have a little bit of space between those photo group beans and you know, that way they don't even have to cross paths, but you know, just all those silly little things that go across all sectors to just make sure. Even. For florists. You know, like obviously if one of the parents is remarried, does the step parent get it for size or a boot near? And is that going to cause a major issue if they don't. Are they going to be like, they're not part of the family, you know, like it just it's so such a thing. You know, that needs to be thought about carefully and out of respect for everybody's emotions, you know, you and I both know that weddings bring out the good or they bring up the bad. And emotions just get totally. Exponentially. Out of proportion on wedding days. And so just really thinking through, from the couple's perspective, what is going to be the easiest route. Of least resistance. To make sure that it's a day that is exciting and wonderful for everybody. Yeah, I think that is a great point that whatever's normal to you in your life. It just needs to be conveyed to, to everybody else too. Right? I mean, we just don't. You know, I mean, like my father passed away when I was very young. Right. And so that is normal to, to my family. Right. But you know, when you're talking with other people and. You know, it it's just not. And so when it comes to the, you know, divorce separation, If you have like adopted kids and feel, you know what I mean? You know, there's all these different dynamics. And so, yeah, I think I definitely conveying that, you know, having the plan or having similar because ultimately, yeah, I mean, everyone wants it to be a wonderful experience. You don't know what you don't know sometimes. When it comes to the vendor side, you know, like, and approaching these. So what, what is the advice then? I know you said, you know, you wanted to talk about, you know, reaching out, you know, B. Getting help from the weather. Some advice. I think you had said before we started recording that you felt like you have having gone through this, having a little bit of separation, you know, being able to look back and reflect on that. So, you know, and this is not specific to the grief of any client right now is real across the board. You know, we know vendors that have lost people to COVID. I mean, this is. Across the board. So how do you, how do you work through and how do you approach that? So I will tell you hands down. The biggest thing that tremendously helped me was faith and counseling. Those were literally the two things that got me through my divorce. And so while, while I was living on the Island still, before I had moved back home to Seattle, I sought counseling from my church. And. I wanted a biblical perspective. I wanted somebody that was going to pray over me. I didn't just want like good luck. Here's what you're going through. Here's your stages of grief? Like. Thank you so much, you know, I just really needed that for me. And so I know not everybody's that way and that's okay. But seek counseling, seek help. Your friends will help you as much as they can, but they're not professional trained, removed from the situation counselors. And that is one of the things that I realized was that when I was reaching out to friends, they were friends with both of us. And so how do you. How do you navigate that and how do you make them choose sides and how, you know, I went through this and I actually called up all of my ex-husband's friends and said you were friends with him first. So if you need to pick a side, pick his, because I will be okay. You know, I've got my friends that I've had. Since growing up that I can reach out to and have that support there. But their skillset is, is limited because they're not professional counselors. And so having somebody that you can. Share everything with the good, the bad, the ugly, everything, and just be totally honest with that person. And have them see from an outsider's perspective, looking in to be able to help you with that small next step. And even if it is like, I am just going to try and get out of bed for an hour today. That's great. That is the small next step that you need to take for this phase in your life. But seeking outside help. 100%. I would not be here today. I'm actually seeking counseling from going through COVID. I am seeing a counselor on a regular basis. I see her every other week. And it's not because my marriage is falling apart. It's not because I'm stressed about finances. It was, Oh my gosh, everything that I built my life around is crumbling around beside me and the state is telling me I can't do my job. And how do I navigate that? And how do I navigate my couples? And so counseling, in my opinion is never a bad idea. But don't be too prideful. Don't be again, embarrassed to go seek out help. Nobody needs to know if you don't want to share it. That's okay. But just really seek out that, that. Third party. And again, like just seeing these, these Facebook forums. Knowing some personal friends that have gone through divorces recently. I do feel like having been so far removed from my divorce, you know, my, my current husband and I will be celebrating our 11 year anniversary. This may. And so divorce was a while ago. But. The emotions are still fresh and they come back. And I can empathize and go through that with our fellow wedding vendors that are going through that. And I just want to know. I want to let them know. That like being on the other side of this, you will make it. I know every day seems so hard right now. And there's some days that are better than others, some days you're yeah, I can totally take on the world. And other days, you're, you're lucky if you get out of, out of bed, you know, so. You will get through this. It is an incredibly difficult time. Seek the help that you need, and you will use this as part of your story, and you will use this as the fire that you're going through will make you stronger. On the other side of it. And it's. It has really. Just a little bit about my background and my story. Like I would not be where I am today. Had I not gone through that divorce. And I know that sounds like a weird thing, but having gotten started in Hawaii and working specifically with Asian and Pacific Islander weddings. That divorce moved me back to Seattle. And that's what, when I started networking here amongst wedding industry associations and whatnot, and going to networking meetings and realizing that nobody else had my background. In Asian weddings. That was what launched my career here in Seattle was Asian wedding specialist. And. That would not have happened. Had I not moved back from Hawaii and gotten my start here? It really just kind of gave me honestly, like the kick in the butt that I can go do this on my own and I can be successful. I didn't need to rely on my husband's job to make ends meet. It was just, it was. In the longterm, it was a good thing. I mean, I wouldn't wish divorce on anybody. But it, it. It's just amazing to see how everything bad turns and con can come out good in your life and make you a stronger person and develop your character and develop who you are and develop. What it looks like even in a career path too. It's interesting that when you were talking about reaching out, you know, for counseling and getting that help friend of the podcast, Kelsey can Knutson is a, she's like a business coach. She was a hair stylist. And she just lives. I was just literally yesterday listening. She started her own podcast about kind of entrepreneurial ship and, you know, building a brand. And it's called when I grow up. But she was talking similarly about for business advice about. Getting help from people that, that are qualified to do that. And, and her analogy was, you know, asking like your, your partner, right. Maybe about business advice. It's like, well, yeah, I mean, I could ask Dorothy about like business advice and that's great, but like, It's almost like unfair puts her in, in that very situation. Right. Cause like she's not, you know, a wedding vendor. Well, you know, I mean, she can give moral support. You know, all the other things, right. But you're, you're almost setting them up to fail asking people, maybe that aren't the right. And like you said, you know, talking to friends and things, going through divorce is great. To an extent and to get that emotional support, but you do need to find somebody, you know, qualified, you know, from like education, you know, counseling, whatever, but also qualified just from my being removed from that situation to be able to give that advice. So I think, I thought that was really interesting takeaway. Cause you know, obviously you want to go to like your friends, like I need help. I need help, which is obviously, you know, really helpful too, but. You know, it's getting that, that outside. Qualified help too. I think. Is interesting. I was going to say, I felt, I always felt like going through getting married, made me a better vendor because I had no. You know, and also it's an age thing too, but I had no. Idea what it felt like to go through getting married? You know, I felt like I was very un-empathetic to kind of the situations of planning and stress and stuff. And do you have, and then, you know, when you go through it, Then you're like, Oh my God, that's why they were answering my emails, you know, the week before the wedding. And that's why they felt like this, all that other stuff. Having gone through divorce on the other end of it. What knowledge has that helped you bring now back to two weddings now that you're going through and having been married again, but especially that divorce in the grief, going through the weddings now. Yeah. It definitely made me very empathetic to parents that. You know, have been divorced and what the couple might be experiencing if, especially if it was a fresh divorce while they were getting married. My parents were going through a divorce during my first marriage. Back in 2000. And so I, I remember the situation that, that put me in, you know, and it's a weird thing. So I think empathy is a really big part of it. But also knowing like, You know, obviously you want to make sure that like the couples making the right decision moving forward and, and whatnot. And I think just being able to share my story of, you know, if I don't share it with everybody, it's not something that I just blurt right out at the consultation. Hey, I've been through a divorce, but. Just really having that conversation of, you know, Yeah, I totally know what it feels like to feel like you're going into a forever, you know, and I'm here for you throughout this entire process. And, you know, I have had couples that have broken up. I've had three over my career that have broken up. During the engagement. And I think those couples are honestly the ones that I feel the most connected to because it's like, That took guts, you know, that took a lot of courage to break up before our marriage. And I would much rather you break up now, then go through years of a unhappy. B or not the right fit marriage. And, you know, I'm proud of you. Like that's a really hard thing to get through and to come out, knowing that you will be okay and you'll make it through this, you know, it's, it's. It's just such a weird, it's almost a taboo subject to talk about, especially around the world of weddings. And I think that we just need to be okay with like, Life is weird and our plans don't always pan out the way we plan them to pan out. You know, I, I, for sure that as a 20 year old bride that had known this guy since high school and we bought our first house together at 19 years old, you know, we, weren't going to take over the world and. Certainly thought I was going to be married to him forever. And I just don't want there to be that, that embarrassment and that. The recoil and that. The emotions that come along with that, like you said earlier, kind of that failure and it's, it's not, it just. Bummer life didn't work out that, okay. Let's move on though. You know, like we'll get through this and, and who knows what is in my future? Yeah. It's, it's so hard. And especially, you know, and. You know, we're a part of, you know, 1% of a fraction of the life right. Of the couple, you know, but it is. And, and I, you know, I'm friends with a lot of brides and grooms and stuff on, you know, Instagram or whatever, and I'll. You know, There's been times when I'll see a picture up, like that's not Tim with you. What is going on, you know, and you're almost like. It's weird. You know, it's almost, you're afraid to ask you don't you don't know you. I email all my couples, you know, on their anniversaries. And you know, there is always kind of a fear, right? Is, is this, are they going to be broken up? Is everything going to be okay either? But it's like, Or you said it. Your life is so weird. If nothing else right now, it's really taught us that. You know, I don't know if for better or worse, it's kind of a day by day thing a little bit. I mean, it's hard. It's really hard to plan stuff really far in advance right now. I mean, that was, they talk about, I think, you know, I heard that said a lot before with a COVID in everything that the biggest thing it changed was planning. You know, that you just, you weren't able to plan anything, events, sports, You know, weddings, movies, you know, TV, I mean everything across the board. And so it's. You know, not that you want a normal size. You know, grief or whatever, but I think that you just, I don't know, it, it seems like. We're all in a different spot now, maybe than we were a couple years ago. That makes sense at all. Yeah. And you're, you're actually very brave to reach out for anniversaries. Cause that's actually why I don't reach out for anniversaries. I never, I never post a anniversary picture of like happy one year anniversary so-and-so and so-and-so on social media. Specifically, because of that, I have had couples that haven't made it to a year and you know, that's not very many, but still like, I don't want to like rub salt in the wounds. Right. So I will absolutely repost a picture if a couple has posted on their social media. And, you know, I'm following them and I'm friends with them. 100% Repost that picture, but that's why I don't like keep tracking. Like I don't purposefully repost something. Yeah, because yeah, I just, I just don't want to be. You know, putting them in that position. So you're very, very brave. A lot more years of experience. I know. Well, you know, I feel like sometimes I, if it's a, if it's a questionable one, I won't. You know, it's not an automated thing. It's like, wow. Okay. How are we feeling today? But no, I mean, but it's, you don't know. You people it's so hard and even like, You know, These people. They get married so young and, and. You change? I don't know. I mean, it's the, the thing back to, you know, 24 year old reader, whatever the 34. I mean, it's just like, it's a, it's a lifetime. It feels like a lifetime ago. And especially now with everything we've run on in the last year at this feels like a lifetime ago. So. Yes. And I remember it being that 20, 20 year old, Rebecca walking down the aisle and thinking it was going to be a forever. And I truly think it would've been had he not been gay, but. Kind of wish he would've told me that in the first place. But it was, yeah. I mean, and, and, and looking back, I'm like, why in the world did my parents let me get married at 20 years old? Like, Why did anybody let me do that? And, you know, It's okay to change. And I do think young marriages absolutely can work. I'm not saying that at all. I think short engagements can work short times of getting to, you know, knowing that person can work. Absolutely. But there's just definitely like, Oh my gosh. I refer to it literally as my past life. Because I just feel like it was, it was almost on the decades. Right? So. So 2000, here's this 20 older Baca. Homeowner business owner getting married. Great life. You know, we own four drive your coffee stands at the time. And. Was was. Living high, you know, great income grapes customers came through every day. We got along so well. That it was just easy. It was an easy marriage. Everything was great. And then that day, and, and I'll share with you. What's that day look like it was Easter Sunday after church, we came back to our condo in Hawaii. And. I, I don't know if you believe in supernatural things, but Holy moly, it was. The weirdest experience of my life. We walked into our condo and the power was out. And it hadn't been windy. There was no storm, nothing. The power just out to my room. That's kind of weird. And then. He said, Rebecca, we need to talk and out of my mouth without a second thought. Was, are you gay? And I was, I remember them like, well, that was weird. Why did I say that? You know, and it was just the weirdest experience of like, Whoa, you know, where did that come from? And he read me a letter that he had been writing for the past six months. And through that time, it was, we tried to amicably go through the divorce. We actually lived together while we were going through the divorce. And then I just kept finding out. Lie after lie after lie. And you know, I'm like, you know what? I know we're trying to be friends through this process. But my friends don't lie to me. And you need to move out. And so I actually packed a suitcase and I told him he was not welcome to come back home. And that was kind of the end of it. I moved off Island June 4th. And. Ha hadn't really ever looked back. Like the only communication that we had to have was going through the sale of our home. In Hawaii, he stopped paying the mortgage. And so we actually ended up going through a short sale. Which of course then totally ruined my credit. But, you know, again, you get through it, you get through those things, you know? Ma drops off your credit. Seven years later. So here I am back to a normal person, but it was, it was devastating to go through and, you know, through the transition from moving off, Awahoo back home to Seattle going through the counseling. Going through the recovery with my family, with my friends, meeting people, I started dating way, way faster than I thought I would. I got remarried way faster than I thought I would. There was a guy that, that I dated before my current has been Brian, who. Was so much a piece of my life. I had actually known him from high school, just for the short time we were dating. He was put there truly to just. Reboost my confidence. And to. To just be okay, Rebecca, you're going to be okay. Like you're not going to die an old maid. You're not going to. You're not going to. Be single forever if I don't want to be, you know, and he was just such a boost of like exactly what I needed at that exact right time. And then meeting Brian and, and going through that whole dating process and realizing like, Oh my gosh, this guy could be. My next husband, like, it's just a really interesting. Shift to go through. And the first couple of years of Brian and my marriage, I still continued to see a counselor because he was so different from my ex-husband that I'm just like, and Brian, if you've met him, he is like steady Eddie. Nothing phases that man. He's just this like no high emotion, no lot low emotion. He just is. Like even keel. And that really upset me when we were first married, because my ex-husband would be high with me. He'd be low with me. Everything that was exciting was exciting to him. Everything that was sad was sad to him. And with Brian, I'm just like, where are you? Where's your emotions? You know? And so I actually, I went to see a cow. Counselor, because I'm like, I need to adjust how to live with someone else and how to live with someone new. And, you know, here I've been married for almost eight years of my life and got divorced in 2008, remarried in 2010. So pretty quick, you know, and. It was, it was definitely a learning curve for me of like, Rebecca, you gotta reset your expectations and rework what you're going through. And so I, yeah, I saw a counselor for about two years into our marriage. And. Like I said 11 years in may. I, I joke with my husband, you know, we're at to the point where, Oh, this is the seven year Mark, are we going to make it, you know, Just having those stupid conversations of like, okay, you've, you've made it past my ex-husband. We're good. So. And then like when the year 2020 rolled around, I'm like, Oh, it's my time for the decades. You know, like married when I was. It, you know, in 2000 divorced in 2010 or remarried in 2010. And now we've hit 2020. So it's time for the new refresh. You know, so. It's to the point now where we joke about it and it's fine. It's not part of our everyday conversation by any means, but there's certain things that. He can just totally push my buttons and make me laugh. And anyway, so everything's, everything's good, but it was. Definitely a, a weird process to go through for sure. And it definitely feels like my past life. It feels like something that I, I don't remember. I was married in the past before, you know, at times. So it just, it's a weird, a weird thing, like the more time and the more distance that goes by with. What you've moved on with the more it becomes just this tiny, tiny little glimmer of, yep. There's a little blurb in my background, but it's not. You know, when you're in the thick of it, that's all you can think about and that's all you can focus on. And when you have that distance and that perspective, it just becomes. Yep here. It was. I survived. I made it. Or it's it's and like you said, it's weird, you know, with that. You know, Feeling like past lives, you know, and, and, and go back to, to Kobe to just, you know, Everyone has this sense of like permanence, right? Like this is the way that things, you know, like I spent, you know, many, many years of my life in the TV news business, you know, that was like, The all-consuming whatever. Right. And now it's like, you know, we're in this wedding thing, right? And who really knows. Right. And then it could be you're moving on, but. It's people's lives are fluid like that nowadays, you know, and, and this is the same to go back to, you know, It's like when my father passed away, either my mom had been, they've been together for 17 years. He died at 41, you know? Right. Very young. And now to think like how much of my mom's life, you know, in our life. And my, my brother and I was here has we've all lived, you know, well past right where he, you know, it has been passed away. Right. It is like this whole separate. World. It's like, I don't even like, know what that would be anymore. Right. I mean, it is weird, like where you, you have gone through something and then change in that way. And. And like, yeah, it, it, you know, it combines into who you are right in your story, but it is weird. To move on from that to write and to cause, you know, in some regards, so you want to move on, right. You know, you want to move on with your life, but then also it's like, that was part of your life. It's a weird, it's a really weird dichotomy to kind of go through. It even popped up when. My mom brought over some family pictures that she wanted me to start. You know, decide which ones I wanted. What ones. My sister, which ones went to her. And in, in those photos where some of my first marriages, wedding photos. And it's a weird, like stop and pause. Do I keep these because it was a part of my life or do I get rid of that? And there was a couple that I set aside in my, my husband now, Brian, he was being reduced to this. And he's like, if the tables were turned, you would freak out. If I kept photos of my ex-girlfriend or anything, you would be like, why are you keeping those? Why do you need those? And I. My automatic reaction was, well, I was married. It's different. You know, this is part of my past life. And he's like, why is that different? I, I dated other women in my. Past life and you wouldn't let me keep any of those. So how was the, it was a really interesting conversation that came out of it, you know, of. I think I just ended up throwing everything back in the shoe box. It's now in the corner of a house. And I just, I haven't gone through it since, but I mean, he's absolutely right. He has a wonderful point of like why in the world would you keep those photos when. You know, My past girlfriends and my past life. You know, I don't keep any of those photos. So why would you be keeping ones of. Of that relationship. I know it was a really, really interesting thing to go through. Yeah. It's just, it is. And I think it's different for each person, but it is tough to, to grapple with that, that, you know, keeping what you know has made you, who you are, you know, and then also. You know, moving on or remember that, you know, I mean, in, in 10 years we could all be, you know, on Mars and do another page. But, you know what I mean? It's like, yeah. I mean, you know, and, and so it is such a weird. Just human thing. Where it's like, you know, We set this world around this and my brother is his. So this way, where like in the compulsive and OCA on like this world that's around him is like this unshakeable, right. Thing of like, whatever is going on right now. It's really not right. I mean, in, in, you know, if nothing else in the last year, it's Tato stat, but yeah. You know, being able to, you know, take these pieces along with us as we go, you know, I think is important, but I also think you shouldn't do all on your allowed the girlfriends and. Right. Yeah. 100%. What I'm trying to remember about even last year of being COVID in 2020. And like I said, like our lives crumbling overnight and you're so in the thick of it, That's all you can focus on and that's all. All consuming, right? You, it affects everything. You turn on the TV and that's what you were here. You turn on the radio. That's what you hear. Your couples are emailing you. We want to reschedule. We want to cancel. You're then trying to navigate through this of like, where do I fall in the mix of all this, you know? And trying to have that perspective of this too shall pass. Right. Like you will get through this. We will be looking back on this at someday. Knowing that, Oh my gosh, we survived. And we made that. And. We know, having seen venues close, having seen vendors have to shutter their doors through this. We know it's not going to look the same, but life is never the same. And we know that something potentially exponentially better could be coming out of this. And so even if it's not in the same career, even if your business does have to shut down, which I know is devastating in and of itself. But it is something that could potentially be a stepping stone to something even better. Yeah. It's, you know, as, as we continue to try to get back to normal. Yeah. I mean, normal is going to look very different, you know, and, and it's. It's expedited things that were probably going to happen anyway, in some industries. And another ways, you know, I think like weddings and stuff are going to try to get back, but. Yeah, it's, it's a lot to grapple with. And especially when you're, you know, to get back to the original kind of topic, you. You know where you're grappling with a lot. And then you're also trying to help, you know, these couples that are, you know, working through a lot. It is a weird, it's a lot. And especially, you know, certain vendors, you know, obviously planners, you know, photographers, you know, DJs. Yeah. The people that are really working with the couples the most, I mean, I'm, I'm there if they want to talk, but you know, they don't, it's not like I'm getting pinged every day about like questions, right. But we're, you know, especially the vendors that are, that are working through like all of that stuff along with them, it is a very, it's an exhausting process. Anyway, just to go through that. On a normal day. Right. And then especially then when you're trying to go through it, So, yeah, I don't, I don't know if the takeaway is everyone just needs to have more grace for everybody, you know, and, and just understand that. People are going through a lot. And, and especially when, like we talked about, you know, wanting to be open and honest and authentic and do all these, you know, buzzwords and the 20, 20 thing and post online and everything like. There might be some crap some days, right. And you might not. You know, not by the, you know, In the, in the best movies all the time to, to kind of manage everything. Sometimes it's hard. Yeah. And I, I agree that your point of just having grace with everybody is I think one of the biggest things. To try and remember on a day-to-day basis. Everybody is going through something. Some people are just more vocal about it. And if you can just try and have that remembrance, you know, I'm, I'm not a patient person at all. Like I. My patience is very slim. That's not one of my attributes. But like, even when I'm driving and somebody cuts me off, you know, it's just like, ah, okay. They could be trying to get to a hospital, you know, to see a loved one or. Who knows what? And just, even in those split second. Moments of the day that we have the choice. Do I show that person grace, or do I slip them off? You know, I'll share with you an experience that I just had actually at Ben Franklin graph store out here in Monroe. I. I have not had great luck with their framing department. I'll just put it that way. And I know it's such a little thing. It's frames for pictures, right? No big deal. And I got up to the cashier and she rang up all my items and it was like $20 over what it should have been. And so I was like, wait, am I literally was handing her my card and I pulled it back. And I was like, I'm sorry, I'm just quickly doing the math in my head. I'm trying to figure out how you got to that total. Cause these say one price and you're charging me over. And she's like, Oh gosh. Oh, I'm so sorry. And then she was like, couldn't get the concept that I was trying to pay for three pieces, but only had two that I was physically checking out with because the third piece had to stay back in the frame chops so they could match it. You know, just on and on. And my patience was gone. Like I was so frustrated with her. I was just like, okay, how can I say this easier? You know, so that you understand what I'm trying to do. And you understand where the price point is. And like, I wasn't mean, but I certainly wasn't nice. I was probably, you know, came across probably a little rude, a little short. I drove all the way out to Mary Moore. Dark park went to the dog park with my dogs, was thinking about this, the entire drive and the entire time at the dog park. I actually drove back to Ben Franklin after the dog park. And I apologize to that cashier. Cause I was just like, I know that didn't start my day off. Super awesome. It probably didn't start your day off. Super great either. I'm sorry. I just wanted to apologize for the way I came across and. But like if I would've just had grace in the first place, I wouldn't have been thinking about that stupid one interaction for three hours, you know? To the point where it made me drive back and apologize to her. So I don't know. I'm certainly not perfect. I'm still learning in that department myself, but just the more we can understand that. Everybody is truly. At core at the heart. Does try and have the best interest for other people. I think that would go a really long way in our industry and in our society as a whole. That's good. I think that's a good spot to leave it. I can't imagine what she thought. When you came back in the dorm, I was like, Oh, No, I think that that's good. You know, not to make jokes here at the end, but no, I mean, it's, it's good. It's a heavy subject, but it is one that I think that, you know, we grapple with in. Like you said, you know, whether it's going through a divorce or a loss or gloss of business, or, I mean, anything else? I mean, it's. It's a lot of different stuff right now. We did. Who was it? Anne Marie and Jenny Gigi. And Alan, we did a round table, like grieving the wedding process and kind of talking about. You know, wanting to still get married and dealing with all this crap and everything else. So, yeah, I mean, I, I do think it's good to talk about these things and it's not always fun or easy, but I do think it's beneficial. So I appreciate you reaching out and we could do this talk. It was good. Absolutely. And I'm glad we covered it from both the couples. Slight perspective, as well as the vendor perspective, trying to support those couples and just know you're not alone. You will make it seek out help. Those are the three biggest things that I can offer my advice for. Well, I appreciate it so much again, like I said, that, you know, We're back. He reaches out and says, I got a topic for the podcast. We're going to, we're going to get on and set it up. So I appreciate it. And, you know, just continuing to have conversations every week about everything going on with this, I think is, is important to do so. I hope if people are still listening to that, you appreciate that. And we'll, we'll find another topic next week to talk about kind of in the world of weddings. Thank you so much. And I just feel free to share your information before we go. Because. I'll put everything on there, but yeah. Thanks for you. So if you want to get ahold of me, my email address is info at new creations, weddings.com. Or you can visit me on my website at new creations, weddings.com. And very active on the Instagram. So that's good too, if you want. Many, thanks to my virtual assistant. Well, thank you so much again and check back next week for another fun interview.

Episode 33 - I Just Got Engaged, Now What? - DJs

Well welcome everybody today. I'm very excited for this. We are having started sprinkling in podcasts like this kind of throughout the wedding planning on the best many weddings. Talking about, you know, recently getting engaged and then hiring specifically vendor types. So we did one, I just got engaged, hiring a photographer. And today we're going to do, I just got engaged, hiring a DJ. And so we have three, a wonderful DJ as well, maybe two wonderful DJs in Allen, but I gathered here today and just, I want to hear from, you know, your guys' perspective. I was saying before we started as a videographer, the photographer one that we did was really insightful, even to me, as someone that, you know, pretends to know kind of what goes on in the minds of, you know, vendors of other types. And so I'm really excited to, to hear what, you know, what you guys want today. What couples should be thinking about when they're reaching out to vendors of your type, you know, questions that they should be asking, you know, things that they should be thinking about. So thank you all so much for coming. Greg, why don't you introduce yourself? And then we'll go around and then we'll get into this. Hi, my name is Greg ladder and I am a master of ceremonies and disc jockey with affairs to remember entertainment. And Allen. Hi, I'm Alan chitlins and I'm with best made videos. The assistance to the regional manager. And Mario the value. I'm Marie Audet candidates and I'm with them more events and entertainment. And I do everything from event planning to photo boost to deejaying. Of course. So, yeah. All right. And so I guess just first off, do you think there are, I guess we'll go around first of all and we'll start with Marie, what, what do you wish more couples knew? And this could be taken on a lot of different ways. Are you when couples are reaching out to someone as a DJ, what do you wish people knew more about that you feel like you're constantly kind of, you know, having to, to educate your clients on as they go through the process of hiring. I think the most important thing is for them to know. Their real budget is for it. We tend to get. Calls for people who don't really know what a DJ should cost. As far as a wedding goes, it's a lot of work you're doing a lot more than they believe. And so they think that they should be paying what their friend paid for a 50th birthday party. Whereas we're doing. A lot more than that. A lot of people, I don't think, even realize we have to do a grand entrance toast. Do we have to make your ceremony? So they need to learn about the parts. That they're hiring and DJ for if they want us there from the beginning of the ceremony. We need to be playing prelude music. So they'll need to know that and then all the steps in between. But I think the very first question is they should ask themselves where their budget lands so they can, you know, find the right fit for that. Alan you've booked a couple a once or twice before. What, what would you wish that they would know? And why is it not okay. Just to have an iPod playing at their wedding. No, I'm kidding. Well, I think the first element is that many people say DJ music. Dance party and. That is true. The celebration is an important part of every wedding, but there's a lot more of an impact that a DJ is going to have. And if you, if you have a good beginning to your day, and that goes, starts at the ceremony sound. Where people can hear your vows and the dinner and the cocktails seem entertaining and lively and appropriate. People will then stay around for your celebration. But you, you can have the greatest. DJ in the world. But if, if things have gone poorly prior to that, People are going to be bored and they're going to leave. And, and I want to pay back a little bit on what Marie was saying. I think that couples, when they get engaged, Need to just have some really high level discussions. About what they want. And what's important to them. And so for some, it might be, I want to, I want to invite all my friends. I want to get married in nature. I want to have a wedding on. My parents' anniversary. I want. Great food. I want it to look this way. You know, and from a DJ standpoint, I want it to flow nicely and I want it to be entertaining and fun for everybody. And as you, as you. Or I want it to be well-documented I guess. I could throw a little bone to the videographer who hosts this podcast. So. If you outline those priorities, start at the top. What do you most want out of it? And rather than go into that research with a preconceived notion. Of I'm going to spend X. Just causing people in 40 down how much it costs my wife and I were talking yesterday. About a dishwasher. And. What about whether it was time to replace? I literally had no idea what a dishwasher costs. We haven't bought one in 10 years and I asked her and she, she gave me a sense. But I think as you shop for the things that are most important to you. Start there. And if you find that, that the cost of the, the level that you want of, of professionalism cost more. Then cut down at the bottom. Maybe don't give out. Favors or, you know, I don't mean to presume what you should cut, but I think that's a, that's an approach that will help you get the wedding that you want because you'll be spending the bulk of your money on services that are important to you. Greg, what are your thoughts? Yeah. I disagree with down a little bit. And I, and I think. Toward the end of what he just said in, in the fact don't just call around and ask a bunch of DJs, what they charge, because that's not going to get you an answer. And most companies. And I don't know. What marinas and stuff, but most people don't have their prices published on their website at least locally. And the reason is, is because. And I'm talking about DJs is everybody's services and what you might need are different. And so everybody kind of sets that up and in different ways, just like, you know, if you. Call a canister or a rental company and stuff. Some include delivery. Some don't some have six people working your wedding, some don't, but in our case, You can kind of get an idea a little bit online, but don't take that. Completely because, I mean, you'll find a DJ in Seattle for your work, your wedding from 300 bucks to $8,000. And, and who's to say. You know what the medium price is and what that means, just because it's on the knot or wedding wire or whatever. And it says, here's what people pay for DJ. If you go along also with what Alan said and think about it in terms of what's important to you. I like assigning percentages to those things. You know, and you can kind of wait it a little bit, and I know it's hard to tell exactly what part of your budget should be your food or your, the venue or things like that. But you can kind of get an idea and wait things by what's important to you. And then. Maybe to, you know, be able to up a party of your budget to be able to afford the vendors that you really want and what is important to you then, then there are maybe things and like Allen said, you don't necessarily our job isn't to tell you what to cut, but. You know, A great example and sorry to all the food and beverage people out there, but how many people actually finish their glass of champagne when they do a toast at the wedding? I had a grim on time. Challenged me. I, I walked in to have an initial meeting with him. The the couple and, and I think they were having a discussion about it in the grim first thing he asked me after we introduced each other was how many people drink their champagne at a wedding? And I'm like, I don't know. So I, I paid attention and, and by my rough calculation, Less than half the champagne at a wedding. Get, get drink, drunk, drunk, drank, whatever. And that's kind of crazy if you think about it. I mean, it's nice if your goal of your whole wedding is to have that picture of everybody with their glasses up in the air, where they're all going, cheers, then maybe it's worth it to you. But I can't remember the last time I saw that. But. Yeah. I definitely think, you know, figuring out the things that are most important and it's so hard as vendors because right. You know, whatever profession you do, you know, it could be flowers could be calligraphy, could be anything that is the most important part of the wedding, or it is a most important part. Right. It was really hard. To balance that, you know, and you like, I'm sure everyone has, I've had consults with video people and they're like, we really don't. Care that much, you know, we just want what we have. But I'm like, well, you really gotta, we gotta do all that in there either. So it's, it is. It is. You know, balancing that out. I do think there is that misconception, like you said, with the DJs where it is just the music and especially even now with even the COVID weddings and everything, you know, without lack of a potential DJ, you know, you do obviously lose that lack of someone guiding the ship during whatever events are going to happen, whether that's, you know, the ceremony into a cake cutting and the weird kind of dance things and whatever we do now, I mean, even having someone there for all that stuff is useful. Do you guys all put pricing? Greg said no pricing on the website. Is that something you guys, Marie, what do you do? You advertise the other, whether you look at, for couples with that. So on my side it's there's. Link where they can go and put in and look at some of the packages. But I do I'll even on there recommend that they call. Because that even if they want to book based on what they think they should have, I will not book them until I talk to them. Because a lot of times, people like Greg said, they don't know what they want. They don't know what they need. Miking is ceremony is an important thing. And a lot of people don't even think about that till sometimes a month late, you know, a month before the wedding. Yeah. Alan. Do you think that there's specific questions that would be helpful? Or I guess information, you know, I get emails a lot and it's like, you know, they even forget to put the date or whatever, but I mean, if someone's, you know, and, and obviously, you know, that's just. You know, a brain fart or whatever, but if someone wanted to reach out to you, what is some information right off the bat, that would be important for them to know? You know, I know like sometimes for video they'll put guest count, that really doesn't affect me a lot. Unless it's like five people or 500 people, you know, there's no difference to me between like 80 people on a a hundred people. But whether some things of, if a couple's reaching out that they should know if they're reaching out to a DJ. Well, the. The things that they should tell a DJ are kind of what the scope of the work is. Right? Is it, is it ceremony and reception at the same place? That's most common now, but sometimes it's in both places. And if you, as a DJ, if you, if you need to support the ceremony with sound and the reception. At a different location with sound that can be more challenging so that you may even need to have a second person available to help run the ceremony or something like that. So you definitely would want to share that. Share the location, share the date. And if there are any other extremist circumstance, I don't know that most DJs. Would be impacted by guest size. You know, in some ways. A large wedding requires more sound. But it's also a little bit more like shooting fish in a barrel when it comes to dancing. So you can, if you've got 200 people coming to a wedding on a Saturday night, You'll get critical mass, you know? But if you've got 30 people on a, on a Sunday, It it's more challenging to get dancing going and to. Make it feel like a celebration. So I think those are the things to offer a DJ in your first contact. And. I think that for what you're trying to extract from a DJ. Is. How will. This DJ. Impact my wedding. How will it be different if I hire this person versus that person versus that person. And it can be a little bit challenging. With photography and videography. You can see a sample of the work. With. Caterer or cake, you can taste an example of the work. With video with, with DJs, it's a little more challenging. To do that. So I think you want to invest some time to understand that, that DJ and understand what I would like to understand. If I'm a couple what's their motivation. What do they enjoy? What does that DJ enjoy about weddings? Because if you know that. Then you can kind of understand how they're going to approach mine. I, I will share with you that the, that there are DJs. Who. Are. Are not. Particularly committed to individual couples. They, they may be like the thing, but. Every day, every time they go out, they say the same jokes and they. There's one DJ company that, that trains that they should introduce people as the, the bride and the groom. If it's, if that's the genders of the couple so that they don't. Forget the couple's names. So if I don't remember, it's read and Dorothy. I can just say it now for the first dance, bride and groom. That's. That's not a level of service that most couples want. They want somebody who cares. And so I would say in that discussion with ADJ. You want to get a sense that they. Care about you as a couple. Do they ask you questions? Do they, they want to have a conversation about what you want your wedding to be like. And are they, are they able to maybe make some ideas? Give you some ideas about how you could achieve that. I think those are some of the things. That that can help you get a sense. I believe that the. Obvious questions are around music for couples. The harder questions are around the other stuff. How do you keep, how do you keep the event rolling? How do you keep it entertaining? How are you as an MC? So. Ask about that stuff. It was perfectly legitimate, I think on a. On a consultation to say, how would you introduce my parent dance? Or how would you introduce my first dance or something like that? And let them do it. Because that that style then can, can help you gauge whether that person's a good fit for you. Yeah, it's so hard where, you know, with like video, you know, what I am is part of that thing, but really, you know, for DJs and MCs, I mean, who you guys are is really. Yeah, most of it. I mean, besides, you know, I mean, sound systems and things like that, but they really hired Greg. How do you, how do you balance that and how do you, you know, ask someone that, you know, you introduce yourself as a master of ceremony. How do you help convey that to the couple. You're talking about, like in our initial conversation. Well, yeah, I mean, just how do you balance that? Kind of just, I was just following up with allergies. No. I know. I think that's good. And it's a lot of what we're talking about here is what the title of this is, is. So it's in that initial thing for us, obviously, if they're our client, Then it's different. You know, every everybody's a little bit different, but in that initial conversation, Yeah. I have rarely had people ask me to, to talk about how I might introduce them. But I think that is an excellent question. I rarely talk about music in that first conversation. Sometimes it doesn't even come up. It's almost like at the end I added on just because, well, we I'm a DJ social. We should probably talk about music. So it comes down to what you just asked me, which is we talk about them and what they want to do it, their wedding. And what makes it unique or have they been to weddings together? I guess this isn't any big secret, but there's a question. That that one of my mentors. Actually it's, it's written on the back of his book. And, and the question is, and this is what I've asked every client. This for the last 15 years is give me three words to describe how you want your reception or. It had ceremony, reception, how you want your wedding to be. And I met her just the other day. I, I have found an old notebook and I write it in the same place on the same notebook for every client. And so I started going through and compiling a list of those words and I'm not finished yet, but it's very interesting to see and, you know, 99% Of the time you get the same. 1520 Words. You know, but every once in a while you'll get one where they'll, they'll, they'll pull out something a little bit different or unique or a different spin on it or, or something. And it's, you. You know, and, and sometimes the, the, one of the couple will give you three words and the other one I'll give you three, but most of the time one will give you a two and the other one may be, you can get one out of, you know, or. But it's interesting to hear people's different reactions and what they thought about most people had not thought about that question. Every once in a while, somebody will write back to me when we set up an appointment and they'll say, Well, is there anything I should have prepared? And so every once in a while, I'll throw it to them ahead of time. But I almost like the spontaneity of it. And part of it too, is I've many times, you know, they'll book us, especially with COVID, you know, Some of these clients might have booked me two years ago. And so I. I'll go back and look at those three words. And if they aren't matching where we're at in the planning process, like what if they said originally it was simple and laid back or something along those lines and all of a sudden. I'm doing 37 different activities at their wedding reception. I'll just ask what changed. And, you know, it doesn't mean we have to change anything, but I just want to know why, what was that motivation? What made it shifted? So. Maria. What do you, what do you like to talk about in those initial consults and what do you try to convey the, a certain things that are more important for you and the couples you work with? Actually do the same thing that Greg does in our contact form. It asks what three words describe. Your vision. So yeah, mainly it is about what audience they want, how they want it to feel how they want their guests to feel. And then. You know, cause a lot of times people give you those words of rustic chic. Party. And it's like, let's get a little deeper into that. So that is in my initial conversation is about how they met, what, why they're doing their wedding, which venue they chose and why. What style of food, they're having things like that, what traditions they absolutely have to have. And once they don't even want to go for. But that gets me to know more about them. And them about my style as well. It's it's so interesting. I find myself balancing out a lot where, you know, when I do consults. And maybe this is something that comes from. You know, maybe years more experience. Not to have an AIDS joke at Greg and Allen, but you know, I, a lot of times it's video it's it's well, how do you do this for me? Right. You know, like, how do you capture this? How is this going to look? How's the editing gonna look? How does whatever. You know, from me. And then, you know, I'm always trying to, okay, well, tell me, you know, Try to do my part, to tell you to ask a little bit about it, but it does seem like all three of you guys. I feel like you focus a lot more asking the couple about them and their day. Right. Does that make sense where it feels like maybe to me the consults a little bit more, well, tell us about this video thing we're going to get where you guys is like, Oh, tell me about like, What is your vision for that? Is that Alan is out of the fair. Yeah, I think that's absolutely true because. We are really trying to help author this day with them. And I think that in your case, You are more trying to put yourself in a position to document it. In the way that they want, but. You know, for us. A good DJ is going to be in charge of the flow. And going to keep the ship going and make sure that guests know everything that's going on. So the only way we can really do that is if we know what's going on. So, yeah, so I think we do have to get really involved with that couple and what their personal choices are. I guess, I mean, I think I've probably told the server before and here we have our Halloween wedding this year. I, we didn't know portraits at all. Like we didn't know romantic stuff at all. Like we just did. Yeah. I mean, they had a great day and they hung out, but he was just really casual. You know, and, and it doesn't really affect me. Right. Because we're just, like you said, I'm just kind of documenting right. Whereas maybe if I'm the DJ or, you know, some of the more involved, you know, the, the photography even a little bit, but it's more okay, well, what's going on in the mindset behind that and whether you want the flow to go where I'm just sitting there, it's like, okay, well, if we're not. Okay. I guess we're not doing that right. Or I guess. Does that, it just, it feels like we're you guys have a lot more hands in, right, Greg? Is that, do you feel that yeah. You know, in the absence of a, of a qualified wedding coordinator and wedding planner and I'll, and I'll qualify that is if they work at the venue. Probably not what I'm talking about here, though. There are certainly some great captains and ones who help out with that. But, you know, even if you have a, if you hire a day of coordinator, A lot of times they don't come on board until a month out. Well, at that point, the schedule has been written. And, and it's probably hopefully been written by us. And, and again, if they have a coordinator that's something different, that's a whole different boat and, and then I'm able to focus on other things, but. In the absence of one, which is, you know, more than half of my, my events. We've talked about that. I've noticed recently a few where some of the photographers start doing some of the schedules and stuff, and I think that's so they can do it, but. Nothing against photographers. They want to add in where they want pictures and do all that sort of stuff. I think that's great. But they're looking at things from a. You know, how can I get the best picture point of view, not the overall entertainment point of view and the overall entertainment point of view isn't necessarily just how to make it the best dance party it's. Well, how can in those conversations with our couples. How can we listen to them? How can we find out what they want? I have, you know, put COVID aside. I have plenty of couples who dancing is not the priority of the night. Most most it is, or, or right up there, or is for one of the two of the couple, but, you know, so that means. We have to talk about the other things. Well, what is important? How does it go? You know, maybe looking at the guest list, looking at the age of the average guest and, and those numbers that we were talking about before and kind of see where it's at. So. You know, we're involved from, from day one, hopefully. And, and even if we are working with a great coordinator, most of the ones that I work with, you know, what our fee. Input input on that. Hey, here's the schedule where, you know, four months out, what do you think, does this give you enough time to do this? You know, They want to go and sneak off for pictures here. How do we do it? So no one, you know, Can tell. You know, And so that's the collaborative action of it, which I think is the best. Alan. I know, especially you love getting the input of the photographer specifically into the timelines, right? That is he really drive the most with that specifically, right? I do. I feel like if, if you, if that couple wants sunset photos, I want to plan that in advance. I want to understand what's the sunset time. And if it turns out that we can't get them the couple to that location. Before dancing starts, then we got to figure that out with the agenda rather than. Oh, the couple's gone for 20 minutes. And nobody knew. About that. So I just think. From a couples standpoint, if you hire a vendor team, That you feel confident has your best interests in mind now, and is willing to take all the input from all the interested parties and let them come together and work for you. You're going to get the best results. Absolutely. Marie, I need you for a second, that there was just some background. I. Free for you. Do you, and, and we'll go around to everybody about that. As you know, Greg had said, you know, not everyone has a coordinator. Would you, would it make all of your lives demonstrably easier if someone had a coordinator helping to facilitate some of that stuff. So you could focus more on. Logistics day off. That's a 50 50. In some weddings I've done. The coordinators actually got in the way of the things that the bride and groom wanted to do. And then in others, they have so much going on that. Yeah. I'd rather have someone else do that. But I'm an interactive DJ. So I also have to pull off. Interactive games or, you know, Grand entrances that are elaborate. And so having a coordinator that understands that. Is great. But when you have somebody who has no idea has never had to see one happen, it starts to become very. Difficult. Challenging. Alan. And Greg, do you guys have thoughts about that? Yeah, it's interesting with, with that. Cause you, and, and I agree, and that's why I kind of used the word qualified wedding coordinator and, and, and everybody has different levels of it. Most of the time, if it's, if it's one of the top ones, who's going to be their full service and they're the whole through the whole planning process, they're on board. You know, nine out of 10 times before I am. And so, and I'm there because they recommended me among other, you know, ones and then go through that process. Occasionally ones will come on in the middle of it. You know, this is a good question. As far as to go on with what Alan said is. If you're going in, in your priorities. So let's say you're going through the planning process and you're going through and you decide, okay, I need to pick my date. I need to pick my venue. And then whatever is my number one priority. After that. We're going to go on to next and go down from there. So, you know, hopefully a DJ is up in there and, and once you kind of have that core group, let's say you decide, Hey. I kind of do want to have a wedding planner. Maybe this is something my mom wants to give me because I'm stressing out or I have a new job or, you know, whatever the case may be. We'll then go to your vendor team and ask them who they recommend. I had a wedding a couple years ago, where. You know, they kind of surprised the coordinator and it was funny. It happened right, right around the same time. One about six months out told me that scenario and said, who do you recommend? And I sent him a nice list and. And it was great. And it was people that I worked with really well. And then the other one. On the wedding day, all of a sudden, maybe a week before, they're like, Oh, we have a day of coordinator. And so. You know, sometimes that's in the, kind of is like the friend, which is great. I don't mind that. And that's cool. I'm going to make that friend look good, but. By the time they have their second glass of wine, you kind of lose their attention, which is okay. And, and, but. If, if you ask your vendor team who they suggest and how what's important to you, then, then they are able to kind of help you out and stuff like that. I interviewed with a couple of the other day who did not ended up booking me. But they told me about this day of coordinator that they hired and they spent probably five or six minutes to explain to me why they hired her. Even though she has no experience whatsoever. They didn't know her. She wasn't a friend. And. It was interesting. And, and for them, they almost were making excuses for it and stuff. And I understand if it was a friend and they were helping her out or giving her a break or she helped, you know, everybody's got to start somewhere. But it was kind of interesting that they already were qualifying her. And their question was is how, how I would work with her. And, you know, I said, I'm a team player. I'll work with her. Great. You know, but it'll be interesting if I won't know who did it or where it came from, but it's like hired. The best. Quality people you can. A question I have for you guys is, you know, With video. I don't get too many questions about, you know, like cameras and stuff. I mean every once in a while. Right. But for the DJs, I feel like there's a little bit more, where does that line go of, of what people, cause you know, I've done weddings with less qualified DJs. Like they haven't had to set ups or we've had to move the set up or the famous story we have, we were at block 41 downtown in Seattle and. Ceremony was downstairs. Reception was upstairs and they didn't have to set up. So he just turned the music up really loud. So it, it, you know, it went up through the floor and we were on. This is a true story. I was eating with my assistant Chelsea downstairs and like, the sound is just reverberating off the walls. We had to go walk around outside. But so I guess, you know, at that point, right? I mean, cause you don't want to say. Well, you know, trust your DJ right now, obviously all of you guys would know the proper equipment to have, but I'm saying if someone is trying to hire a DJ. What should they at least check or ask or make sure. Does that make sense, Marie? What do you think about that? Like, I mean, you don't want to overstep your bounds of like asking, you know, like checking to make sure you got everything you need, but like, what should I do as a couple when I'm to make sure I'm covered? That's a tough question. For me because I already, I, or I do know what they need based on which venue it is and what spaces, if it's outdoors. Indoors. So maybe if they do ask directly, what are you going to do for the sound out? In a field. What it, how are you going to Mike us? How are you going to prevent when noise, when somebody's talking, do you have enough? Sound and to reinforce for dancing inside. Cause the building might have three rooms. So. I think that. I always bring up in my consultations. I asked venue, of course, and I, if I've never been there, I research it first, check out all the rooms that might be used. And then when I'm on the consultation call, I'm offering what I believe that they should have. So I think that if people, when they are contacting and DJ, and that person starts telling them things that they should be aware of because of the venue, then that probably shows that they can. They can fix it. I think that's a good answer because it is, I mean, Alan, do you get what I'm saying? Like, it's, it's, it's hard. Cause like you almost like, if you don't know, then it's too late. Right. And then you show up and the people though. So what do you, I mean, just advice for couples, like they should really make sure the DJ is talking about that stuff. I generally don't even know the answer to this. I rarely get questions about equipment or sound or technical issues. And I do think that it's helpful for couples. To inquire a little bit more like you don't necessarily need to know what speakers and what wattage and things like that, but maybe the first differentiator between a professional DJ and someone who's a little less professional is what you were describing. Having a separate ceremony sound system. Because that way you've, you've got the ceremony set up and then the guests can just go straight on to cocktail. And the receptions and the music is going to flow constantly. So. I think you could ask an open-ended question about how do you handle the ceremony sound. And I, I would also, if I'm. Getting married. I kind of want to understand how they're going to Mike, that ceremony. And. There are, there are legitimately different ways to do it. My preference is to put a little lapel mic. On the officiant. And if there is a room. On the groom. Sometimes people will use handhelds. Sometimes people will use handhelds on a stand. And there, there, there are people who don't like that for photos. But. Starting to have that discussion. I can try to give you a sense about where a DJ is professionally. Like if they, if they can present to you multiple options or talk about how wind would impact them. I think that makes sense. I think maybe another level that. Helps differentiate. The. The more professional DJs from the less professional DJs is how they're going to approach. Hosts. From a microphone. From microphone and sound standpoint. I believe that a good DJ should have at least two handheld. What microphones one for the person giving a toast and then one for the DJ to announce the toast. There are people who will have one. And they'll try to do the introduction and then hand the mic to the person giving a toast. And then get it back from them. And I just. It's just. Another way that you can determine what level of professionalism you want. As a couple. My, we had a wedding kind of was it two summers ago and it was with one of those more factory, you know, hire the DJ is probably the same one that was talking about the interest to the, you know, introducing the bride and groom. And yeah. They had given the, they have the necklace land, your thing with the microphone, which is like the worst luck in the world. You know, they don't have the lapel, they just have the handheld with the necklace. And then yeah, they, they realized that they had no way of telling everybody to sit down before the ceremony, because the only microphone they had, you know, was up at the front of the thing. Greg, how do you, how do you balance that? The two where, you know, what should they know? What, whether, you know, curious your thoughts. It's interesting too, because Maria, I don't know if you do it too much, but I know Alan and I do though. It's a lot of these kind of national Facebook groups for DJs and stuff. All you gotta do to get 500 responses to a question is ask about some of the latest gear or, or how to do it cheap. And there's always these links to these. Just crappy. Like Mike wireless mics now. Long story short, but, but we lost another half of our wireless spectrum last year. And so for the second time, in 12 years, we had to buy all new microphones. And so, or almost all. And so that's, you know, that would be so, so that's an interesting landmine question. You could totally ask somebody, at least for the next couple years. It w how that affected them. And if they've no idea what you're talking about, that might be a good kind of. No thought. But when you look at some of these ones that are these just knockoff ones and things like that. They just have, they're just going to sound like crap and they're and they're going to be theirs. You know, they're gonna have very limited options. And, you know, they're just. It's just not going to be a professional aspect of things. But if you ask about it, Almost when people start talking about it for too long, it almost gives you a heads up because you know, like, I don't know how you guys do it. Exactly. But as far as packages and things like that, but you know, back in the day off, every DJ had like three packages and it was basically. Some version of small, medium, large, and then if they were had more than one DJ, how much experience the DJ had and, and still probably I'd say 75% of the companies do it that way for weddings. And or more so you can, you know, It's more of a commodity you're going on and just picking if you want, you know, XYZ. And, but what I did about, I don't know, it's been about 15 years ago now, is I. When and, and. Instead of the client picking out all of the gear and the equipment and stuff. Well, let me do it. If you have any questions about how I'm going to do it, ask it. I'm probably going to give you a quick description about what all you guys have just talked about, about. Wind in that particular room. And here's how I did it. Last time I was there or something like that. But. Let me figure out what to do, what to bring. I had a, an event, I guess. Yeah. It's funny. I keep thinking like you did read last year. No, two years ago. Okay. I was at, at a venue up into the homage in, in about a month before the wedding, I get a call from the bride and she's kind of a little panicked and she's like, Hey, my cousins are coming to town for the ceremony and they want to play a song. For the reception or for the ceremony and they're going to play. And she goes, I don't know. They're going to do ukuleles and they're going to sing. And, and what can we, you know, can, can you just call my cousin? I don't care what it costs and, and. Just take care of it. And I reminded her. I said, Hey, it's all included whenever you need, you know, if I have the gear or, you know, can get it, I'm happy to include it. And so. I called up her cousin and literally it was, it was two ukuleles, which had a guitar pickup in it, which I didn't even know. They made ukuleles with a guitar pickup. And plugged him in and two microphones. And I actually had a little, self-contained a little system that I cause the room we were in was really hard to wire them up to me with where the bridal party was going to be. So I did a sound check and they had their own little sound system. And it sounded great and it was cool and, and it was fun and it honestly was one of the highlights of the night. But to be able to do that and just have the freedom. I know, like I said, you know, three out of four companies in town would have charged them. I don't know what you guys think. Three, 400 bucks to do something like that. And, or more cause we microphones in the stands and all that stuff. And it's like, let's just make the client happy. And, and, and obviously there's things that are way crazy. I had clients one time that needed one of those. There, they had a senior coming in that had a writer. And so we had to provide this like $3,000 microphone. Okay. I don't have a $3,000 microphone. I got some real nice ones, but we did have to go rent that one. So that was fine. It's it's so interesting to me because yeah, tiny there. You know, the ceremonies, things like that. How many times, you know, cause. You know, we'll, we'll always run like a backup feed off the DJ. And how many times I'll show up and be like, Hey, so what microphone are you going to use? And they're like, Well, I don't know. What do you think. Right. I know, but I think, but I also wouldn't want to have the, you would have that decision ahead of time. But, but also, yeah, just it's tough that way. And, and to, I had another funny story there, I totally lost my train of thought, but Oh, And then I'll ask him, Hey, are there going to be any, like any people giving speeches, like during the ceremony, like any, are they going to your, any readers or anything I've added? They'll be like, Oh, I don't know. I don't know. Aye. Aye. I think we need to know that, like, are you going to have them. Or is there another microphone? Are they going to go? So is that when it comes to stuff like that? I mean, do you guys almost have to outsmart the couple and just like ask them a bunch of questions about that? Or should a couple's like, no. Or where's that, Marie? What do you think about that? Like, You know, when it comes to. You know, even this summer, Like, and not to give too many stories. We, I was just Mike in the ceremony. There was no DJ. There was just, you know, it was two couples and they each had kids from previous marriages and they were coming together and we just tiny little ceremony at Chateau. Well, Well, during the ceremony. She gets up and goes and walks 10 feet off to the side to read a note to his children that you know, they're coming into the family. Right. And I felt like a dumbed down, cause I had no way, you know, I mean, his microphone's on the fishing, Scott and Mike and all this. And so I, you know, for, for days after it, as a guy, you know, is that my fault? Should I have asked that, but that, so where do you fall in line with that of should, you know, an ass, should you be prepared? Like Greg was prepared? Where, what do you think. Well, I actually provide all of my clients, wedding clients, and bar mitzvah. So those big event clients event timeline software. So they, so I actually set this off the time. Ahead of time and then give them access so that they can go in and put notes like that because those things are super important. I've had things where I actually specialize in doing Asian cultural type weddings and add Filipino weddings. Sometimes you have. A bunch of family members coming in, they're going to do the hula and there's like six band members. And so you have to know. You know, what's going on and where it's going to happen, but yes, it, it, th those, those are details that I've actually had clients who didn't think that that was important to tell us. And then they all showed up and said, where's our mic. I was like, No one said you were going to be here. So, yeah. If, if you can't at all, You know, Find out that the, the happy, fun things you want done at your event and make sure that all the vendors know cause one of the things I do is collaborate with all of the other vendors on the timelines that I supply so that they can actually look over what we have. And if, if they don't, you. If they have a note, they can put it in there. And we can make sure that all vendors are handled. Yeah. One of the F w. Literally one of the very first weddings I ever did. I remember the mother of the bride surprised everyone and hire like a horse drawn carriage or something like right after the ceremony to like, I don't know they went around or something, but didn't tell anybody. Didn't tell the DJ for the time. I did tell the photographer. Didn't tell them, you know, it didn't tell me, didn't tell anybody. It's like, Like you said, if it's something important enough to be, I just think that's great advice. If it's something, you know, if you're taking the time to put that in your ceremony, make sure you're telling your DJs, your professionals about that. Right. So we can figure out the best way, because I can't. It was like, you know, the bribe this summer with the kids is like, I can't, you know, especially this summer, we're balancing a lot of different stuff where the regulations, everything is like, I don't. You know, we do our best to ask the questions, but it is your Al where, where do you fall, fall on that? You know, where it's, you know what I'm saying? I think it. It is incumbent on. The. The DJ to extract that information from the couple. You know, and, and I know that the three of us and most of the other good DJs will have planning forms and we'll ask questions and. Absolutely the example with the reader. Or just walking through the logistics. Who's going to be where and how all that will work. You were talking earlier, you asked me and I ignored it. How about an iPad wedding or an iPod wedding? And couples are doing that. And for some couples. That's great. But like, it's what they want. It's potentially what they can afford. If you are doing that. You want to think through these types of scenarios though, because it will be more incumbent on you to say. We have a reader. How are people going to hear that reader? For those kinds of things that if you just have somebody that is in control of playing. The. The song when somebody comes down the aisle or something like that, and hasn't even thought yet about. Miking people. You got to. You got to lead that charge yourself. If you're a couple. Yeah. It's I've had so many conversations this year about that, especially with the live streaming stuff where you're, obviously, if we have a DJ it's, it's way more helpful, but he has like, I can give you a, I can put the wireless mic up there, but like, it's just coming to me. It's not going anywhere. You know, it's not [unknown]. I mean, I've I say that. 18 Times. You can have before. And it's like, I just want you to know. Cause you know, you, you always know there, you're going to get me a fishing day up and then they got there. They're like, is this working. You know, but because you tried to tell him. Greg, what do you think about all this? Yeah, well, you and I had the one event we did not cover together. We went through the different scenarios with all that, like 12 different times. You know, and, and trying to figure out what, cause we were broadcasting onsite and online. And it does give some unique challenges. You know, the, the zoom, you know, when people do the zoom weddings and, and. That's one of those things where you have to it's either going to look good or sound good. If, if you do it yourself, probably not both. And so you have to decide what's important or higher. Higher read. Best made videos. There you go. You can quote me on that one. There you go. I think it's, you know, again, it comes back to what we talked about in the beginning about what's important, you know, and, and, and coming down to it and then trusting your vendor team. Alan, you said it great with that. I mean, it's just like putting together this great team. And, and, and we know it. I mean, when, when we look around. One of my weddings, unfortunately got canceled last year, had this just if I was to make a list of my favorite vendors. All these vendors would have been on that list or, or, or, or close to it. And, and so, and, and when it got canceled, I was like really disappointed, not just for the couple and, and all the ramification from that, but I was disappointed from my own. You know, like. Selfishness a little bit, because this was going to be just really well run. And we had all worked together before and, and it was one of those ones where you just have to look across the room and nod at people and you know exactly where things going and. And, you know, scheduling, like Maria said is really important and going through, and listing and stuff. But also remember too, that. Just because the time is on there. It doesn't mean that that's the time it has to be done. It's more of the order. There are certain things you have to hit you, you know what time it's probably going to be done. Ish. You know what time sunset is going to be? You know what time. The ceremony is going to start around, but, but everything else in there that's the order of events is what creates that flow that you're looking for. And so if you're a couple who really wants to have lots of dancing and you want people to dance, my philosophy on that is then let's get everything done leading up until the first dance. Every people have different philosophies on it, but, and I certainly can do it other ways, but that way. If we're all done with everything, then the end of a party of his art is our dance party. And we can go and create this flow and stuff. I suggest that to couples who say they want that dance party, it doesn't mean that's what we're necessarily going to do, but they usually trust me. And, and that's the case where you'd know. Now, if it's a couple who doesn't care about that as much. Oh then maybe one or when we were not allowed to do dancing, you know, with COVID and then we're going to stretch things out, or we're going to add things in at other points, but that's that thing where you, you can talk about it and. And create that atmosphere, which goes back to those words, to that. I was talking about before what's important to them. The last thing I want to touch on, and then we'll do kind of final, you know, any final thoughts from you guys. You know, just managing the sticker shock sometimes with couples, you know, with the DJ, you know, There's huge w right. Wide range, right? I mean, So, so where do you, and I don't even want to dictate too much thoughts on that, but just how do you mitigate that with couples where they're like, well, I'm just going to get the guy for, you know, the guy or girl for 500 bucks on Craigslist or whatever, because, you know, we can, or what is all this, how do you, Maria, how do you kind of mitigate that sticker shock and, and not prove your worth, but kind of, you know, maybe justify whatever word you want to say, you know, for the couples. I think that couples are actually more educated on price lately. The calls I have gotten in the past year. They all know that the average is, you know, 1800 to 2,500. And so I haven't. Had to deal with a lot of the under that amount. However, If somebody says that, then I just tried to let them know that, you know, That's great. If that works out for you. And I understand if there's anything I can do to help, I'm more than happy to answer questions and try to help them make sure that that person can help them out. Oh, where do you fall on kind of mitigating the sticker shock. Well, one piece of advice I want to give to couples. If you want to get the lowest price from a vendor. Don't ask the price question in your first contact. Most people in the wedding industry, in my opinion, Take pride in what they do. And there is a consensus among wedding professionals. That they just don't like that hire you available on August 7th. And what's your price? Right. So start a conversation about, are you available August seven? And what do you do? You know, what, w what are some of your services? What, what is available? It is true that some vendors after you've had a conversation with them, May feel like you're a good fit and may give you a quote that's slightly less than they would have told you at the very beginning. Yeah. In terms of overall sticker shock. Everything's expensive. Weddings are expensive. Every category is expensive. And so I just, I think you have to have your priorities and if having a smooth flowing reception where. Everybody can hear and it's entertaining. That is the kind of situation where. Spending the money on a quality DJ can be helpful. If, if that's not the most important thing to you, then. Then don't don't spend it. Right. Yeah, like you said, everything exists. If we, I just had a concert last week and it was mother father, they were hiring for the son's wedding and it was just like two day Indian wedding ended may like 10 hours split both days, you know, two events in the morning, two events at night, they wanted. Four videos and then one kind of overarching. And so, you know, we're talking like six hours of deliverables. Right. You know, plus all this. And I'm just, I, you. You know, and I told the guy, I said, you know, when we're on the flights that, you know, you better sit down here, you know, I'm going to give you this quote. And I said, it's not, I sit in, you know, you just tell me to F off then, and I'll go away. But I say, you just, you don't even know how much work this is. Right. And, and I don't even really either I'm. Just kind of guessing. You know, I can just presuming. But it is like Alan's at yet, everything's expensive. And I just, you know, and, and they found someone else and I said, that's great. But I like, I mean, th that's going to be a month in my life, you know, coming out of this and, and just to do that weekend. So. Greg. What do you think about that? The, the sticker shock. Yeah, it's interesting. Over the last. I'd say 10 years or so, I've seen a trend of an take a couple that, you know, that's a groom and a bride couple, as far as that goes, where. Used to be 95% of the time. I, I would get a call from the, from the bride or her mom. And then our last 10 years or so, just kind of come down where, where it's the groom calling. And now it's probably 60, 40 groom. And, and as part of that too. And I'm not trying to be totally stereotypical here. It's different for everybody, but, but a lot of times the only thing they're asking is are you available on our date and how much do you charge? You know, And so I understand you have to narrow things down a little bit, but I figure if you're calling me, there's a reason. Or emailing me. And so it's either your venue referred ID or a personal one, or you found me on Google or whatever. And you've already narrowed it down. You have eliminated some vendors that you've looked at, or so let's say DJs in this case. And so for whatever reason you want to give me a call. So like Alan said, then let's go and, and, and take the time and spend the time probably if you're, you know, I'd say narrow it down to three to five would be my recommendation and then take the three to five hours out of your life. And it's fun to do together. And nowadays you do a zoom call or we used to, I mean, it's, it's, it's almost easier now for everybody because you can just do it like this and, and, and just have that conversation because you want to know. You're going to put money in this one way or the other. And so you want to know, and I'm a big. In one of the reasons too, I went to that all inclusive model or pricing is, is I don't like to be nickel and dimed. And so you're in, I want to give people a really good value. So on the surface it might appear that, Oh, this is more expensive, but a, like I talked about before, you're not going to pay more money and B you're going to get a good return. And you know that I'm going to put my time into that. And if we have that conversation for an hour, Then we'll you'll know that. A, we're a good connection and we want to work together and be whether you're going to get a good value for your money. So, you know, a friend of mine, one time use the, the, the hamburger comparison. You know, you can, you can go get a hamburger at McDonald's. You can go and get a hamburger at red Robin, or, you know, you can go over to a Danielson, get a $40 hamburger. Which one is best for you? Well, it might depend on the circumstances. It might depend on how much money you got in your account. It might depend on, you know, who's paying. So it just comes down to what fits best for you at that moment. Yeah, that would be, I think my final advice. And then we'll go around. Greg brought up, you know, especially Harvard on zoom and stuff. Now I really do think there should be no excuse to not do. Due diligence even now with researching vendors. I mean, I really do mean that and like, cause I can hop on a zoom call for 15, 20 minutes or a phone call and feel way less bad about you hiring someone else than driving across town and traffic and not hearing back or whatever. So, I mean, but I mean that, that, that I think maybe that should be a whole nother podcast about, you know, interviewing now in the time of COVID then. And just the freedom that you could call up a bunch of different vendors and talk. I think that, that, I think I'm already constructing the next podcast in my head as we do this. Well, we'll go with Marie kind of final thoughts, anything you wish people would know, you know about. Hiring questions, things. I'm sure. I didn't ask something that you guys are all screaming at me and your heads. Sorry. I want to apologize for the sound. I'm actually onsite at a venue right now, and they're doing tastings. You're good. No. No, no worries at all. Yeah. Can't think. Yeah, please. All right. Well, well that Murray ended. Alan. What do you, what do you think? Any final takeaways, things you wish people knew. Yeah. One thing that we didn't talk about is music. And I think that if I were still lift the curtain for couples. Behind closed doors, DJs. Have mixed feelings about how much input they want from a couple. If a, if a couple gives them a long list of songs. Must play and do not play. There are DJs. Who are kind of offended by that. And they'll say, well, I'm not a jukebox. I can't believe they gave this to me. And so I think a great question for a couple to ask is how much input do you want about my music? And you may find that some of the. People who are you're talking to are musicologists and brilliant. And, and, and if they limit you, you're fine with that because they're known for playing the right song at the right time. But if you're passionate about music and you really enjoy Pitbull or Rihanna or country or whatever, and you want to pick some songs, make sure your DJ is okay with that. Isn't it isn't it's, you're seeing that we got, I don't know when we actually start recording a, you know, an hour into the DJ podcast and we just talked about music. So I think that that's. But, but I mean that cause, cause there's, so it's the same with video. I mean, there's so many other things that go into it and especially with hiring a DJ and an MC let's go to Greg and then we'll end with Marie. Well, I think that's telling, and it's something that, that the music is important, but it's also easier now than it has been it's ever been before. You know, Alan's got really great Spotify lists and you can go through and look at it and stuff, but also on our clients, they all think about and, and would pick music in different ways. And so you want to be accommodating for that. And what I always tell my couples is you can be as involved or uninvolved in the music process as you want. Most of the time I get to guide them through that and go through it. But. If we're going to talk about that and then initial conversation, I'll get a feel for, you know, where they're at and where they've done a list. And I even, I do kind of like it when, you know, We're a year out and they've already got a Spotify list going and Island. I always tell them about how you can make folders under each of your Spotify playlist. And they always think that's really cool. Cause nobody knows that you can do that. But I think the biggest overall thing as you're going through and what you want to get a feel from your DJ is, are they proactive or reactive? And read the guys you were describing that they don't know when the toasts are going to happen. Yeah. They're reactive to what's going on. But when you, when you get a chance and that only comes from experience, it comes from getting weddings. If they're just looking at it as another gig. Then it's not it. This is not there. There are so few events in life that people will remember. Every single moment for, for the rest of their lives. Good bad or indifferent and, and you don't want to be part of the bad part. Or even the indifferent part. And so you want to make it that personal stuff. And so if they're being reactive to what's going around to go, what's going on around them. That's not the person you really want at any price point, but if they're proactive and they know I'll give you a great example is a wedding I did a year and a half ago. That same one went to ukuleles. Actually we're at a venue and everybody got done Eaton early. And I went into place that there wasn't a coordinator, but they. The staff is very nice and, and, and it was toward the end of the season. So they'd done a lot of weddings. And I went up and I kind of said, you know, the toasts weren't too scheduled till seven and it's literally like six 15 in the last people are through the buffet. And I said, and nothing is scheduled in between those times. And I said, what. What do you think about moving the toasts up to like six 30, five, six 40, something like that? And she's like, She gets her list and she looks at the schedule, which I had written. With the couple. And, and she said, Oh, well, they're not scheduled till seven. And I said, well, is there anything preventing us from moving them up? You know? Cause I know they want to clear this. The tables and get the champagne poured and stuff like that. But we got plenty of time to do that. And she, she looked at me and she said, well, let's go ask the bride. And I looked at her and I said, what's not. And, and she kind of looked a little startled and, and, and I said, I said, no disrespect or anything like that, but she's empowered us. To, to make those changes. I said she doesn't have a watch on, I said, And the girl looked back to me and this is a girl probably. Probably realistically had done 40 or 50 weddings that summer. And she likes smiled like this huge smile. Like somebody had just given her the power to do what was best for the event and not just check things off a checklist. And so that was her and I being proactive and, and get it. And then the best result for us was this was a couple who really wanted to dance. We got 28 minutes extra of dancing, so that's pretty cool. All right. Maria, you're going to, you're going to take us home. Any final thoughts takeaways. I totally agree with Alan and Greg on all their points. And it is extremely important that you do. Match with the music though. I have had, I have DJ. I have other DJs just like Greg probably does. And they don't do country. You do need to bring things like that. If it's something that's totally. Different than the variety dance party norm. And then as far as when thing I, I recall from your last podcast, personality is very important. They, the client needs to feel comfortable with us that we need to, to not be way too energetic for their personalities or way too under. Because a party will totally fail. If a bride is extremely shy and she's got a super energetic DJ. That's not going to cut it. It's going to freak her out. So make sure that you, you know, Find out that your personalities in the middle, your DJ needs to be able to connect with your crowd, but also with you. Yeah, it's a great point. Yeah. And it's, it's so interesting how all these come back in and we'll do more of these in the future too, but just it really, Mel. Meshing or whatever, vibing with your, with your vendors in the personalities, because you can't have someone and, and, you know, and, and I can work with anybody, but like I have certain photographers that I know clients that hire them. We don't vibe the same way that we do with other people. And it is interesting, you know, certain clients, you know, like I know an Allen couple, right. If we're going to do a wedding or whatever, I know great. I mean, it's just interesting, but that, that is a thing that happens, right. Where certain vendors attract certain. You know, Types of couples or personalities. And, and so it is interesting. Thank you guys all so much for coming on. Let's do a, a real plug here at the end, Alan. No jokes this time. And then we'll have everyone say goodbye. Marie. If anyone wants to learn more about you, everything you do and your services, where would you have them check out? I am more-events.com. Or Seattle dj.com and. You can give me a call. I'm also on Facebook and Instagram. And more, and it's a L a M O R E. And Greg, what about you? Yeah, Greg louder with the Ferris to remember entertainment. I'm DJ seattle.com. And. Look us up on there. And. Fill out a form saying, hi. Alan don't fail me. Take it serious. Seriously. I am Alan Chitlik and my company name is Puget sound, DJ. Perfect. Killed it. Thank you guys all so much. I really appreciate it. And we'll, we'll do more of these. I think it's really interesting to hear. This side of it, besides all the topical stuff going on. So, thank you guys so much again and take care.

Episode 32 - Contracts and Rescheduling

We'll get well, Cindy, thank you so much for joining today. As usual, we produce this podcast week to week, and sometimes I'm trying to figure out like, you know, what is the topic du Jor, whether it's the thing we want to talk about. And in my own, you know, business, we're dealing with some. A wedding cancellation rescheduling contract things. I unfortunately, I think that that's going to be more of a thing. Now. I've talked a lot on the podcast since last March when we started this, that I think a lot of people did truly believe, okay, we're going to either postpone the next year. We're going to get married this year. Smaller, do something else next year. And I think now, as we see this dragging on and on that might, I just had a phone call with one of our June grooms yesterday or the day before. And he said, If, if there's any more hiccups they're just canceling, right? Like they're just totally off it. A lot of people off it. So we're talking today about contracts, cancellations, refunds. You know, why you should ask for them, why you shouldn't all the different things, trying to see it from both the couple's point of view and also the vendor's point of view. And so Cindy is a planner and, and she has written a phenomenal blog about this that I've read. And it's been shared a lot online and I thought, what better person than the come on? We can talk through this. I think it's very well written and. Just kind of get your perspective and basically do your blog and podcast form. So thank you so much. Why don't you introduce yourself after that long intro and tell us who you are and what you do. You got it. I'm Cindy Savage. I am the owner and wedding planner. And as of last year, officiant at ILSR traveled here in Seattle and like everyone else in the wedding industry, I've been dealing with COVID and its affects on my business at my clients. And, you know, TLDR of it is it sucks for everybody. But yeah, as you know, at that article, you mentioned, I wrote actually over the summer, In July of last year. And it's now six months later. And in many ways not a lot has changed, but we have no reach that point where a lot of folks, especially those who had weddings planned for earlier in 2020. Are now. I'm approaching they're postponed wedding date and thinking. Am I allowed to swear on your podcast. I forgot. Yeah, we'll keep it. Cool. And they're thinking, Oh, no. Are we going to have to reschedule again? Or should we just cancel? You mentioned speaking to one of your clients. I ha you know, of course I've had many, many clients who postponed their weddings from last year to this year. And I just had my first one from this year who just said, you know what? Forget it. Oui oui. They were, they were very kind and I'm very blessed to have just fantastic clients all around. And they very kindly were like, yeah, we kind of figured that a 225 person wedding. May this year probably wasn't going to happen. And they just decided to cancel everything and. I'm sure they will eventually get legally married. I don't believe that they did that yet. Although many of my clients did, like you said, did that last year with the anticipation of celebrating and a bigger wave this year. So, yeah, it's, it's a round. Around two, once more with feeling, right? Yeah. Well, and that's, I think that's the hardest thing is, and I know, like I said, we've talked about it on here before this whole idea that I think a lot of the people really did believe, you know, okay, we're going to postpone or we're gonna, you know, we're, we're going to do a small wedding this year and then we're really gonna do that thing next year. And, and, you know, life gets in the way things get in the way and in. I think people are having doubts. One of my wife's good friends, they are going to get married in October. They were going to get married last October, did the backyard wedding. And then now. You know, w we just did a podcast talking about the vaccines. How are we feeling timeline wise? And, you know, they, they say Fowchee. He says, if all goes, well, you know, maybe by the fall, we'll be back to some normalcy. Right? Well, if I am. You know, someone planning a wedding in, in end of October, November. I don't know how I feel about that. Right. And so what I wanted to talk about today is this whole idea, you know, we've over, I guess it was last Monday. We had the love man that was like wedding 300 and something for us. And so [unknown]. Pre COVID in the 300 plus weddings, you know, we had done, I think we had had one real cancellation where, you know, contracts had to be enforced and things were paid. I have a very. Escalating cancellation clause on my wedding contracts as it gets closer to the wedding date. And so what we're finding right. That's very typical across our industry. Yeah. That too. And so, you know, I only take 25% down, you know, I don't, and I know some people do the 50% down and that's fine. I don't feel comfortable holding down the amount of money from, from a contract and we do 25. And then, you know, it's a year out, nine months out, six months, six months out, and then three months out. And as you cancel things are, you know, get. Escalated more and more up to where, you know, if you're going to cancel three months out. It's not refundable at that point. Does that sound, does that jive with kind of what you would think? Yeah. And it does vary a little bit, depending on which part of the industry you're talking about. For example, As a planner, I'm doing a lot of work with my clients from the day we, from the day we signed. So, you know, my payments are structured a little bit differently. Most of my clients are on monthly payment plans. And for me, everything's non-refundable once you pay it because I'm always working for them. As soon as they book. It's a little different, for example, with videographers photographers yet there's absolutely prep work involved. Of course, there's the cost of holding a date, which we can talk about later. It's in the article you mentioned, you know, but some other people are investing both time and hard costs ahead of time for your wedding. So caterers florists, for example. They have to buy those flowers. They agree in the ingredients for the food, you know, Baker's the same thing and, and prep, all those things before your wedding actually happens. So, you know, Depending on when you canceled it may have already done some of those things. They may have already shelled out money for that stuff. Some people pay their staff either a percentage or a whole amount in advance of the wedding. So there there's no matter what vendor it is, everyone's doing some amount of work before the wedding. In addition to holding the date for you. So, so it does vary a little bit across, you know, the different, different parts, but I'm 50% upfront and 50% about a month before the wedding is fairly typical for most vendors. And that does usually cover those kinds of hard costs that happened before the wedding. Too, but yeah. And it's in a structured, kind of graduated cancellation policy. Like that is also very common. And for the same reason, you know, you have those upfront costs costs, but also the closer it is to a wedding date, the less likely it is that you're going to be able to rebook that date with somebody else, if you lose it. So I don't know how it's worded and your contract or anybody else's contract, but in my contract it's where does that as liquidated damages as, and that's income for. You know, my grocery bill next month that I was expecting to have. And if you pull out with only three months, notice I'm not likely to be able to book another wedding on that date. And kind of recoup that loss. Yeah. And, and, you know, as we get into all this too, and it's, it is just fascinating to me. I mean, I know this isn't like a, the most pleasant of conversations. But it is really interesting. It's terrible. But, you know, and the whole idea too, is, you know, as we get further into this cancellations, It, you know, people say, well, why. You know, if, if I booked, you know, if I want to cancel, you know, that might be my right or whatever, obviously. Right. But you w you have to think about too is where we have a limited number of inventory. Right. I might get six different inquiries for the same, you know, may wedding date. And so, because we booked in, you know, whatever. Because you choose to cancel maybe five of those six other couples wouldn't have chosen to cancel or would have chosen to postpone or wouldn't have chosen to elope and then cancel their wedding now afterward. Right? That also goes into that conversation, right? Where? Yeah. You know, yes, you absolutely have the right to do that, but because of that, maybe not everybody else would have handled that situation the same way on there. Does that make sense? Right, right. Yeah. So, and that's exactly why these sorts of clauses are, are in contracts. So. One of the [unknown]. What is the thesis of your, of your blog posts? For someone that is curious about it. Cause it does seem to defend a vendor's a little bit, right? In terms of like, this is why we are vendors, this is why I'm positive. Why do you want to summarize it? Sure. When it's the short version of that and where I think there is a disconnect is that our clients, as a whole. They think I'm paying this person to work my wedding and the product they're delivering is whatever service they're doing for my wedding. Planning it providing the flowers. You recording it on video or photograph or whatever. But in actuality. We are providing that service, not just for your wedding, but for your wedding on a specific date. And in some cases at a specific time. So if you look at it, if you think about it in terms of inventory, so people say like, Oh, I, I decided not to have this wedding. Why can it give it back? Like at Ikea, I changed my mind about this desk. I can just return it anytime in the, within the year that I bought it. Right. Or anywhere else. Most places have a return policy of 30 days or whatever. It doesn't matter. And if you decide you don't want it, or it was defective, you can return it. But for us, that piece of inventory, it's not our service. It is the combination of our service on that date in the date is really what dictates our inventory. There's 52 weekends in a year. Almost everybody wants to get married on a Saturday. And most of y'all want to do it on a day when the weather is possibly going to be nice. So you don't see a lot of winter. A lot of winter weddings, especially in colder places, you don't see a lot of August and July weddings in hotter places. Like, you know, the Southwestern desert areas. Texas, et cetera. So when you say, well, I'm no longer going to have this wedding on the state, can I get my money back? The real question is, well, can we resell that inventory? And that is this the same reason we have that graduated cancellation policies because you've, you've put that inventory on hold. That's why most festival called the first payment we take from you. A retainer or a booking fee or a date hold fee or something like that. And it's because it's not. Only to pay for the services we provide or the products we provide, it's also to pay for holding that specific date. It's almost like a layaway plan, except we can't always resell it to somebody else because once you've taken it and particularly in the case of COVID. Once you've taken March 17th, 2020. On March 18th, 2020, that date is expired. It's like a piece of fruit that has rotted. You could give it back, but it can't be resold. And, you know, unlike a big grocery store that could maybe accept. Or her reimburse you for rotting produce. We almost own the vast majority of wedding industry professionals are very small businesses. A lot of us are solopreneurs with part-time contract staff. And we count on every penny that comes in, that comes into our bank account from y'all and. This year, you know, usually in a given year, like, you know, I'm going to have a lot of cancellations. Because now, you know, most of you who say you're going to get married in Booker services, you do it. And barring a, you know, some kind of really bad working relationship with us. Or, you know, A breakup of your relationship or something tragic that causes the entire wedding to be called off. It's not common for weddings to be postponed or canceled. So we don't usually deal with very much of this. And with the pandemic we have had to deal with, not just, you know, the one every year or one, every couple of years, maybe a couple of year, if you're a higher volume vendor that we typically deal with, but we are instead of dealing with. Having all. All of her weddings, postponed or canceled. And the other components that, so that's why there's cancellation fees. And it's also why there's postponement or rescheduling fees. And that's because, you know, we have, we've held, you know, the rescheduling fee is essentially like buying that new piece of inventory, right. Buying that new date in our calendar. What what's happened with all of these postponements is that our full 2020 count or for a lot of us has now shifted to 2021. And not only does that mean we're servicing you for an additional year in a lot of cases. And again, it depends on what, what vendor you're talking about, how much additional work that might be. But we're also now. Having removed a second date from our inventory that we also can't sell to someone else. So if you got a postponement. And your vendors didn't charge you for it. You basically got a two for one deal. You got to prime dates for the price of one prime day. And that's, you know, that's where we're the fair amount of money. And if they charge you a postponement fee, that was significantly less than whatever your first retainer was. That's still a pretty good deal. Cause it's like buy one, get the second one half off. Right. It's like a little BOGO sale. Yeah. And that's what, you know, Well, we had tried to do a lot was, you know, Weddings. Luckily, most of our couples moved to non-prime dates, you know, we're we had a lot. I've been moved to February and now. Moving those, but, but, and that was fine. Cause I'm like, I'm, you know, The fact of me, you know, working in the wedding and on February 11th or whatever, or we have a wedding. You know, on Friday the 12th. Probably wasn't going to happen normally. Right. Right. Yeah. You like the open box discount, right? Yeah. You know, they give you a new one, but I can give you open box one. Yes. Yes. But then, you know, we had did that a lot with couples that wanted it. You know, a prime date the next year. And, you know, we did charge him a fee and I try to, if it was a prime day and then I tried to give them a service that was like equal value. Like something that wouldn't cost me, but like, okay, we can give you an extra. Like the raw footage or whatever. You don't do that. Like as an example, that would be what we would do with something they didn't cost me, but maybe to, to, to, to soften that blow, because that was a very, it's a P. Yeah. And I don't mean to, by, by sort of like putting on the suit of armor for the vendor side of it. I don't mean to downplay how much this sucks for couples because it's sucks. It's terrible. You know, you thought you were going to have a great big wedding and now it's like, not only can you not have a date, which for some people was a super meaningful date in their relationship. Or like, bless all those people who want a 10, 10, 20, 20. I'm so sorry. I think I had about a dozen inquiries for that date. And I had one booked. And guess what? They didn't get married on 10, 10, 20, 20. So it sucks because you were expecting. The wedding you planned. You were expecting to be able to hug your friends and your family, you were expecting to be able to dance your face off. And you were expecting to have it costs what you thought more or less, it was gonna cost. And so to be hit with all of these rescheduling fees or losing retainer payments and stuff. It's a huge blow. It's a huge blow to couples too. But. You know that what I hear from a lot of couples is, well, the pandemic isn't my fault. So why should I have to pay for it? Which legit? It's not. But you know what, it's not our fault either. Why should we have to pay for it? And so really what's happening here is we're we're splitting the burden. We're giving you a new day to this kind of price and you're paying a little extra to habit. And it sucks for everyone. Nobody's happy about this. I promise you. There's nothing more that wedding pros want them to get back to doing weddings as usual and to not have to postpone your dates. We don't want to charge you fees. I wish I could. I wish I could just move everybody to state and charge them nothing, but unfortunately I'm not Jeff Bezos. I don't have billions of dollars sitting around to pay my rent with if I don't have money coming in. So I can't, I can't stay in business if I operate that way. And that's. Why we have these things. Yeah. Yeah. I w no. And when you bring that up is an excellent point. You know, we, I just did a, the second draw of the PPP loan, whatever that they, you know, they did the one last year and then they are, and to show that. You were eligible for that second round, you had to have a decline of, I believe 30%, you know, and he's the one quarter. Last year. Or 20, 19 to 2020. Oh, we're at 2021. And I was 45% the whole year. It didn't matter. A quarter didn't matter at all. Right. So that's like you said, Where it sucks for everybody. And, you know, just imagine that imagine if, if you're, if you were getting 60 grand a year or 80 grand, you know, whatever your salary was and literally just chopping out 45% of that. Yeah. And, you know, and then not only that, but then knowing that, that this next year. You're going to be making up a lot of that money anyway. Right? Like a lot of that was shifted over. We have booked very few less new weddings for 2021. As we have moved over weddings from 2020 to 2021. Yeah, it's really becoming a multi-year issue for, for everyone involved. And I mean, you know, lots of our clients understand because lots of people have lost their jobs or had their hours. Cut back. So they know what it's like to lose it, to lose their income with no notice. And we're having a significantly reduced and. It's true. That what also is happening is it's not just like we have less States to offer for 20, 21, but we also have less people booking with us for 2021. Understandably, because there's still so much uncertainty. You know, we're standing here today. It's February 10th. When we're recording this and, you know, I might get vaccinated by April. May we don't. We don't have any idea. And we're also hearing about new strains that are coming out. They're more viral and that can spread faster, which may or may not be. Stopped by, by the vaccines we currently have. So we just like, there's, there's so much uncertainty that we, nobody honestly knows. When we're going to be out of this and when we're going to be able to go back to weddings. As usual. So, you know, even. Everything. I've written about COVID basically has become old news. You know, within a week or two of having been written, all of the, the, the, the thesis behind this article is, is, has nothing to do with COVID actually, but just as how the wedding industry, the event industry in general works, but. But we just, we just don't know what's coming down the pipeline. And the reality is for 2021 and maybe even 20, 22, we all collectively vendors and engage people. We're gonna need to reimagine what a wedding looks like. If we want to be able to have them this year. Yeah. And, and one other point I wanted to bring up to when you were talking earlier about, you know, facilitating, you know, the dates and the fees and all that kind of stuff. Cause I got an email today from Apple and it was interesting cause. Yeah, they're big thing is always like, you know, sell us back your old devices. Like we'll recycle them. Right. We'll give you money. We'll do you know, [unknown]. Like you said when you're dealing with a small business, like a wedding vendor, right. We're Raby were, were servicing your 10 days to 50 days to a hundred dates a year. Right. We just don't have that infrastructure in place. Like Alvelda's well, we can buy a billion devices back and like shine them all up and send them out. You. That they have this whole infrastructure set up were us. Yeah. If, you know, w when you. You know, once you take a date. You would be amazed how many wet, you know, how many emails you get for the same date every year? You know, whatever date that is, right. There's always dates that are super popular and sometimes it's sensible like 10, 10, 20, 20. Pretty number dates. You know, Four three, two, one, anybody do an April 3rd, 2121, four three, two, one. Like those kinds of numbers are always, you know, anything that can make a palindrome palindrome with the month. Anyways, there's always numbers that are popular, but then there's always other days that are just like, who made this state popular? We have no idea. Right. But then you'll get like 10 inquiries for the same date where you have a weekends in either side, you've got no inquiries for, so. There's just some kind of collective consciousness I believe about. About which wedding dates are the right ones, you know? Well, absolutely. So w w what couples don't get is if I book, you know, July 1st, whatever for you. Any other email I get from that, it's not, Oh, Hey, thanks for your inquiry. Well, I have a wedding that day, but then the, in the, in the circumstance and maybe it cancels, it doesn't happen. Like, why don't you, you. You know, can I have a month to get back to you? Is like, no, I mean, you tell them like, right. We're reserved on that day. Thank you. Best of luck. Here's someone else that could be available, you know, whatever your policy is. Right. But there's no like waiting game around. I'm like, well, you know, could you give me a month just in case it doesn't work out with this other couple. What's your look, your book, right? Exactly. And that's why we collect the retainer and have a contract. Cause we're holding that day, you know, it's, we're turning actively turning away other potential income for you. That's why we have those fees. But, yeah, and it's not like we can be like, well, I'm not available July 1st, but how should I get married July 6th instead I got that one open or maybe the 23rd. You know, It's just not. I like it because I'm a planner. Occasionally for me, I have flexibility around the date. If I'm helping someone find their venue. But other than other than venues, that's really. Once you got a venue, you got a date and it's solid and it's not like you're going back. Well, my venue gave me this day, but my photographer when's that date. So let's like, you don't shift it. It it's just not how it works. I remember when I think the first year we ever did the wedding show. Cause I, we got in really late to this yellow wedding show. Like I think we got signed to like October, November, you know, and the things in January. And I remember that first show, like. If all these couples would just have booked a different, you know, because we have so many booked already. And then you're like, Oh, we're booked on that day. One more time than they were with it and in my head. But it's like that doesn't work that way because couples. Pick the ones they pick the Saturdays they pick made in October and then they ride with it. And so, yeah, there's no like, well, you know, August 8th is, but what about the ninth? Let's let's really working on that. It's like, no, I mean, they're, they're set by, especially by the time they come to us, you know, there's no, I had a long conversation with this mother that she was trying to, ah, trying to plan last minute for my daughter and all this. I'll tell you if they was Sunday, they would have the smorgasbord of anybody they wanted to hire. Right? You want to get whatever vendors you want to get married on a Tuesday. Nope. We're all free. Maybe not in 2021, because we've got some, some actually have a 20, I actually have it Tuesday wedding this year because it got moved from last year. But. Yeah. Yeah. I know if only we could assemble our dream teams of vendors and then pool their availability and then pick our date. Right. Which, you know, I technically you could do, you just really, probably want to start with a planner who can deal with that for you. Cause it's a lot of scheduling logistics, which are no fun for almost anyone. Except those of us who think it's a fun thing to do all day. It is far between. It's nice to get those every once in a while you get that, like, Hey, we've got two dates in mind. Like which 1:00 AM I bet is always like, yeah. You hardly ever get. Yeah. Yeah. Well, it's been interesting too with, with the rescheduling, like that has been. Because we've been trying to keep our vendor teams intact. It's been an interesting thing to be like, Oh, here's our dream vendor team. Now, what dates do you all have available that we can make work? I kind of like. Not to reinvent the wedding industry, but wouldn't it be cool if that was the way we've worked a little bit. I think so. I would enjoy it. Personally. So someone want to talk to you about is, and then I want to get into the specifics here in a little bit. Forced mature. Right? That was the big, that was big. Thing words. Yeah. All the blog posts and all the contracts, rewritten, you know, Forrest, Missouri. That's basically like active gods is preventing you right from, from doing it. And I read that is the only time, you know, COVID or whatever aside. In the last three years that force majeure would have ever happened for us. Was that like sliver of whatever a month in Washington, right. When like nothing was allowed at all. Like it was a stay at home order and literally nobody could work. Right. But ever since then. You've been able to get married, just not necessarily the wedding that you wanted, which is regrettable and that's terrible, but, but, you know, by governor Inslee saying, okay, you know, Everyone has to stay at home. Right. Was that the, Oh, am I reading that right? That, that was the only time from your understanding where you really could have said like, Hey, after God, we can't get married right now. Well, I am not a lawyer, but. Yeah. That's fine. I'm not a lawyer, but all the lawyers I've talked to seem to agree. Yes. So the. It's I think there's some gray areas in some places because, but, but for most of us, Guest count is not a line item. You'll find, I mean, you may see it for reference on our proposals, but I can tell you that there's literally nothing in my contract about how many guests are at your wedding. Now I'm going to staff it differently. If you have 300 people versus 30, but. But my contract is not dependent on the size of your wedding and most vendor contracts or not. There are some like caterers who have a minimum minimum, either a minimum number of guests or a minimum spend. But for the most part from a legal perspective, If you two can get married and celebrate it in some fashion than forced. Mature is not preventing you from. It's not preventing. It's not preventing us from performing. Are part of the contract, nor is it preventing you the couple getting married from performing your responsibilities under the contract. So. You know, it's people have given different amounts of leeway for their own businesses, and we all have to do what we feel is best and ethical and. In that sense, but from a legal perspective. Yeah. That the time when we were literally not allowed to per government order, that would have been the time when that applied. And at this point, people who are booking new contracts. He has been a year, almost weave. Or it has been a year, I guess. With that we've had a global pandemic running. And if you're booking your wedding now, where your wedding vendors now. You know that it's a possibility that, that coat, so that the point of force majeure is too. Relieve you of, of your duties that you have agreed to your responsibilities under the contract, in the event that unforeseen circumstances make it impossible for you to do them. So, you know, An earthquake happens and your venue is reduced to rubble on the ground. Your venue, can't provide you a venue on your wedding date. That's a force majeure situation. You know that. But, but we're, we're beyond that now. It legally. Yes, [unknown]. I just think it's so important to know that cause it, and we just had one. One of our couples, just, we, we postpone them again. They postponed to 20, 22 and they said, You know, because of everything, you know, we can't have the wedding of our dreams and you know, it's not what we envisioned and we want to move it. And we had already gone through, you know, the last year to this year, we had a negotiated, a new contract. And I felt it was prudent for us to just extend that another year. Right. That was a personal decision that, you know, that Reed made that, you know, advice we ever, but I felt like, okay, we had already kind of like rip that band-aid off the first time, but, you know, I could have said. We need to charge you again. There's nothing about anything going on right now. I mean, knock on wood. That that is going to happen. That is preventing you from getting married. Whatever data may or whatever day it was this year. Right. That in my, the only be 30 people and we might have to do a live stream and zoom and a bunch of people or whatever, but there's nothing that prevents that, you know, I chose that. You know the other option of that, but I just, I think that's important for couples to know that they just legally where I think again, we're not lawyers, but legally where the understanding is is if you can't get married and have a wedding. Right. I mean, we're going to be there. Right. And you know, the difficult part is that weddings are. Generally once, maybe twice or three times in a lifetime events. Right. We don't, they're not something we do often. And both culturally and individually, we have big feelings around them. And for a lot of us, we've been raised to have an idea and ideal of what our wedding will be from. Basically the time we, you know, popped out of our mother's womb. So it, it it's difficult because from a legal perspective and, you know, from our perspective as vendors, you know, putting aside for a moment that we're also humans than we have empathy, but from a legal and business perspective, your wedding with us as a business agreement, we have a contract and that's what we operate under. And the contract says, if this happens, that if that happens, that if you reschedule, you pay this et cetera, And we do that too. To protect our businesses and our livelihoods. But. We are also human beings who have our own feelings about weddings. Many of us are or have been married and we understand what goes into it. And we have empathy for the situation. So, you know, that's why you see a lot of people having different. You know, there's not like a unified policy in the wedding industry about how to deal with COVID because we each kind of have to do not only what's best for our businesses, but also what's best in our hearts. So, you know, I've made my policy's a little bit more flexible. I've been allowing anyone to reschedule within six months of their original date. Whether we're shut down or it's just not the wedding you thought it was going to be. And after that I'm charging reschedule fees because I have to, to stay in business, not because I want to, because I really hate doing it, but. You know, but, but that is a luxury that I can afford right now. And not everyone can, and you know, on the, on the flip side, like some people can afford to charge no rescheduling fees, then move things all around. So there's a lot of variation and there's not a clear. One size fits all approach to this from the industry. But. I can pretty much promise you that. We all have a lot of empathy for our clients going through this. I mean, My, my couple that just decided to cancel, like, I felt terrible sending them a cancellation agreement and being like, K. So. Sorry, buddy. Right. Like, because I, you know, I don't know about you read, but I know a lot of people, vendors, like we become friends with our clients, especially those of us who spend a lot of time getting, you know, as a planner, I see my clients, usually at least once a month. My full planning clients and, you know, I emailed back and forth and text with them. And. I care deeply. About them in their lives, not just about the money they're bringing my business. God, nobody gets into this industry for the money I promise. But. It's not as good as they make it out to be on TV, but yeah. Right. Right. You can't see, but Reed's doing the, like the dollar. The stripper dollar. Thing. Yeah. So it's. It's just really. It's heart wrenching. It's been a really hard year for everyone and we're all. You know, we're so. And not only that, like we, we look forward to your weddings. We look forward to being there and celebrating with you and seeing those happy moments and capturing them and making them happen. Feeding you delicious things, making the room beautiful. Like. We love what we do. And we are sad that we don't get to do it with you. Right now, or that we have to do it in a different capacity. Although, I will say that I am personally very, very fond of teeny tiny weddings, and I think they're the best. So if that's what you got to do this year, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised. Bye. What it looks and feels like, and it also gives you a little more room in your budget with less people. Like you can spend money on things that maybe you wouldn't have spent on before. Like maybe now you don't have to DIY your centerpieces because that extra catering money can go to flowers or something, but. Anyway. Yeah. And so, yeah, so I want to talk some specifics now. I don't want, I don't want this to come across as, you know, airing, dirty laundry or anything I want to cause, cause I, I have a feeling that this same circumstance is going to happen. A lot of the times for a lot of vendors. And so that's my goal with this. I hope I really hope it doesn't come across as like, you know, Erin, anything out of, you know, and obviously no names or anything, whatever, but I really just wanted to come across as like, if you see other things like this happening, this would be maybe advice or things to do or whatever. So we have a couple that was going to get married. Last June. And very early on, they decided to postpone and we further contract, you know, we waived the reschedule postpone to another off peak date. This coming year. And that was fine. And so, you know, so we moved down, whatever. So I, you know, I found out from them. A week or two ago that they had decided to go the loped in December. And now they are. Because of Kobe than I would imagine, because they're married now. That's, that's my putting my spin on it, but you know, they're, they're saying, but anyway, They're canceling their wedding this year. Right? So we postponed it. They've got engaged or they got a loped, all this kind of stuff. And so, you know, The big thing that came to mind for me. And I had tried to express this was. I really wish that we would have had conversations about this in November and not February. Right. And the response that I got was we would never discuss things like that with any of our wedding vendors. Why would we, why would we discuss personal decisions like that with our wedding vendors about trying to, you know, get married or whatever. And I would think I've talked with many of my couples about postponing and your options, or what do you think. Wait, am I off base with that? That conversation would have been helpful in November or October or whenever before then, then two months after the fact. Oh, I don't think so now. And, and I mean, You know, I do think it depends a little bit on. Your relationship with anyone specific couple and also your role in the industry. So, again, as a planner, I'm on, in very regular contact with, with all my clients more so than most other vendors are. And. I think from a vendor perspective. Part of it is just being very proactive. Like I've been setting my, all of my clients updates, no matter what they've told me, their plans might be or how they might have changed every couple of months, like here's what's happening. Here's what we're allowed to do right now. Here's how I'm enforcing my contract policies. Here's what's going to happen if you reschedule here's what's going to happen. If you cancel. So I think to some extent, just getting ahead of it from a communications perspective is really important. But I do think if you're a couple listening to this podcast, And you're thinking about making a change. If you have a wedding planner, definitely talk to them. And if you don't have a wedding planner yep. Do reach out to your vendors. Because like I said earlier, we, we do care. But it. Again, like. And I'm not going to say. Necessarily promise that you would get money back or more money back, but the sooner you can let us know that your plans are changing. The more time we have to potentially we were booked the date, or just strictly, maybe it's farther out in terms of that kind of. Graduated scale of cancellation fees and stuff like that. So, and the other thing is for a lot of your vendors, if you, if you decide you're going to go ahead and get legally married. Just in a tiny celebration, even if you're still planning a big celebration. They may be willing to come and provide their services for your. Elopement or micro wedding and, you know, Then, if you ultimately decide to cancel, you will have at least gotten some of those services. Right. So you don't lose it. So the thing is when you cancel you basically. For, for, for, for most vendors, you're going to lose whatever payments you've made. You're not likely to get refunds, especially at this point. We're so far into it. Especially if we're getting the people that are on there potentially third or more reschedule. It's just. It's just not, it's not easy to be giving out refunds left and right with all these cancellations, especially if your contract doesn't provide for them. Which which most don't. So, yeah, I just, I would, yeah. Yeah. Communication is big. Yeah. And, you know, and, and I think. I think I was probably a lot better about that. You know, early on and you know, maybe I did take my foot off the gas without a little bit, but I also think, like, I also think regulation's in October, maybe don't matter for a June wedding yet just because how many. Things have we seen change in the last right? Exactly and things change so quickly that it's just, you know, It's hard to say. What's going to happen even three weeks from now. And it reminds them three or four months from now. We just don't know. So, you know, there. There's sort of two sides to it. One is like, I don't know, a way told us a little bit closer and see what's in place then. And then we'll make a decision, which is fine. I just kind of recommend you have a drop dead date of at least a month out because there's a lot of things that get finalized in that last month that will, you know, affect, affect the costs and stuff. But it's when people start ordering their supplies and their ingredients and. Finalizing details and all that stuff. And it's also when a lot of final payments are due. And when a lot of people have a final cutoff for a graduated cancellation fee. So there's a lot of good, like just strictly money reasons to, to. Make a decision by the one month Mark. Ideally a couple of weeks before it. And then there's kind of the other camp. That's just like, I can't even deal with us anymore. And I just want out, which I frankly totally understand. Yeah. Cause it's not something that, you know, it's not something that anyone wanted or planned, but I do think I'm, like you said, A lot of the decisions and things were handled, right? Postponing weddings of last year under the presumption that they would indeed happen this year or at some point. And so now, you know, canceling. Cause I just to emphasize kind of what I said at the beginning of the show, I do think a lot of people thought they're going to get married this year. They. Right there. They're going to either alone or cancel whatever. So that's what I'm trying to address today with all this stuff is your, you maybe did really think we were gonna get married next year, but also I, you know, your vendors may or may not have charged you cancellation fees or scheduling fees or whatever. Under the presumption that it was going to happen next year and now it really is never going to happen. Then that is a different conversation entirely. It didn't like, Hey, we're just. His back a year, right? It's well, this thing that I held you, you know, that, that we, you know, that we met about and we zoomed about, and you did all the paperwork about, and you send it over and you held the day. Then that day went by and you turn down other weddings. And then you've dealt with me emailing you every week for six months. And now we're back now. And then you, you did all the reschedule and that was another two hours of paperwork and you've done all this stuff. And then now we're not canceling. Or now we are canceling. That's a really different conversation, you know, then. Yeah. Yeah. What I'm saying. And I think at least what I'm, what I'm seeing in my circle is is that people who may be waived a rescheduling fee in the, in the first round are now, like, I just can't afford to do that anymore. When, you know, realistically, you probably couldn't have afforded to do it in the first place. Maybe shouldn't have, but. I think in some ways that like, Set clients up. Wrong. Because they said, Oh, well, they w they didn't charge me last time to move it. Why would they charge me this time to move it? So, in a way, we sort of screwed ourselves on that one. If we didn't do a fee the first time, or if we had a very lenient policy, the first time. But, but you know, we're all, we're, we're all trying to figure this out. You know, Pretty much, none of us have ever dealt with a global pandemic pandemic on this scale before. I think the last time that happened was before anyone who is currently living was alive, maybe. Or, or. If they are they're way too old to be a wedding industry pro. You gotta be a little younger for, for the way we work. But, but yeah, I think I also think that a lot of wedding vendors realized last spring. Where they might've had some holes in there. Contracts and holes in their processes. And a lot of those holes have now been plugged. So you're going to see different policies. More fees, restrictions on how many times you can postpone before you need to sign a whole new contract and pay a whole new retainer. Or, or limitations on how far out you're allowed to push the date, that kind of thing. So all of those things have started. Becoming more prevalent. For a lot of folks because of last year, because we realize how at risk are businesses are. In a situation like this and. So, yeah, that's definitely going to be a thing. And I think for couples, it's going to be even more difficult as, as they look at. Either postponing yet one more time or canceling altogether. In either way, they're going to lose some money. They might have to pay you more money. If they're canceling, they might have lost not only an initial deposit or most of their payments, but also a rescheduling fee, which now seems like, why did I even pay that? Right. So. It's. Once again, it just sucks. It sucks all around. But yeah, I do think people are getting a little more kind of firm. In their policies because, because of what we all went through last year, Yeah. I mean, and that's, that was basically kind of my, just my interpretation of everything was. This, you know, COVID is an issue. Now it's going to be an issue. Yeah. That is not like you said earlier, you know, any contracts now that are entered into anything we've ever in. You know, We've done weddings. We've done weddings. I've done weddings every week. We've done weddings, small weddings, baby, whatever weddings. And so, you know, I look at this as if you had booked a couple in September and then they decided to cancel or whatever for their summer, whether you, I would handle that the same way now. Right. We have the wedding of the only, like the first cancellation we ever had. I mean, it was the Wednesday before, you know, Dorothy and I were gonna, we were getting married. We were at the courthouse getting our paperwork. For our August wedding and I got an email and it was. Or call or whatever from the father of the groom, like, Hey, we're canceling on, on Sunday. Or on Saturday, right? And that would be, you know how I look at this now? I mean, I look at any cancellations now. I mean, It can be because of COVID, but that's not, that's not the be all end all. Now that is gonna, I think this is. Ride everything. What I'm saying the same. Yeah, people are going to kind of either revert back to, or. Forward to their new policies and it's, there's going to be a lot less flexibility, I think on. On those things going forward. And, you know, I, I know for. I added a new clause in my contract to provide for that sort of six months, grace period of rescheduling, due to a pandemic or any other force majeure event. I didn't have that in my contract before I did have rescheduling fees and cancellation clauses, of course. But, you know, tho those things are, you know, now if someone canceled, if it's because of COVID is because not COVID. Kind of it's all, it's all cancellation or it's all rescheduling as far as. My contract and how the finances work. And I think we're just going to see more of, I think we're going to see an industry why kind of moved to. Enforce those policies. Even when it's a COVID related postponement or cancellation. It's stuff. I, the first one of these really, you know, we had, you know, March, April, may, June, we had done gone through all these different, you know, whatever and move stuff and done all this other stuff. And the first real sticking point I had, we had this September couple. And it was the first time that they came, they came out and they said, you know, working on saline. And that is that, you know, and we want, we want the money back and like we're canceling. And I told him, I said, you know, I've rescheduled. You know, 30 weddings, we've downsized, a bunch of other weddings we've done just we've applied that retainer. Just to cover the ceremony or we've, you know, split stuff and I'm whatever, you know, we've done every which way of any sort of bending over that we can. But because you're coming to me with this unflexible decision of, you know, we're canceling, that's it. We're not doing it. Then that is where a lot of vendors are going to put their walls up. Right. But this is the contract. This is what we have. Whereas if you had come into like, Hey, yo, these are cold. And that's why I had mentioned before, you know, Again, you might not really care what read the videographer says about, you know, and I, I absolutely understand my place in the world that would ever, but I'm saying if you had come to your vendors with flexibility versus like, You know, brick, whatever in flexibility, like it, it just allows for a different conversation. And it allows for different options. Absolutely. Yeah, this is what. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I have a client who was supposed to get married last October and they decided in the summer that they didn't want to. You know, they didn't think it was going to happen. And they decided to elope and I was able to convert their contract from a wedding management contract to an officiating contract. And I went and officiated their ceremony instead. And obviously not everybody provides multiple services, so that's not always going to be an option. But there are you. Yeah, you're right. If you, if you asked a couple approach it as we don't think this is going to happen and we want it to, what, what other options do we have at this point? That's a much more flexible conversation than just like. You know, Effort we're out. I would say, yeah. The same would go is let's say something happened where I had to, you know, we couldn't, I couldn't perform my duties anymore or whoever didn't, you know, I think I see the slot photographers online. Hey, you know, something came up, I got pregnant, someone's sick, someone, whatever. And, and I'm going to have to cancel, but you. Can can, can we get a couple of names of people that would be available? That will be a good fit. Let me vet you guys so that when I go to talk to this couple, I have some options. Right. And that'd be the same thing for me. If I was like, Hey, I can't do it, but you know, I got this other company they're, they're going to do it. Or, you know, we'll give you a refund for whatever, or like give them. You know, a couple of different things. It's being like, yeah, I can't shoot your wedding and like, sorry. And walk away. It's a different conversation to have at that point. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. And with a lot of vendors that are on there, you. If your wedding, you can't happen the way you want it to, or you're just not gonna get along with it. They're there. Perhaps other ways that your money's you've already been paid and even balances that are coming up through can be applied. You know, maybe you're not going to have a wedding anymore, but. I can now plan your first baby shower or someone can just come do. Couple portraits for you outside at home and distanced, or, you know, Take a video of you together or. Deliver you a batch of cupcakes, you know, theirs. Tina event pros were really flexible weddings. Aren't the only kinds of events that exist. So there, there are other milestones in your lives and just simply fun things. That you can do now again, every vendor has to do what's best for them. So not all vendors are going to be able to let you be flexible with your, your commitments that way. But. You want know if you don't ask and if you don't ask respectfully, it's much less likely to happen. And that's a good, yeah. Attitude matters. Yes, it does. It does. And it's, it's the, you know, it's easier to ask forgiveness. It's easier to beg forgiveness. This asks permission. Well, not all the time when it comes to contracts. And so I would say that sometimes it is easier to, to ask permission or not. Not, you know, that's just the, you know, the same. I mean, I think it's just easier to have that conversation. Before things happen and they go, Hey, we got married two months ago, or three months ago, or last year, we're not doing this. And we have already, you know, we've canceled everything and you're the last person to know, or, you know, whatever the situation may be. Right. But it is very much easier to have that conversation. When everyone's on equal footing. And then when you feel like you're right. Kicked in the butt or whatever. Right. And it's not, you know, that's not even just coping specific, but like, you know, I'm. I'm sure. I'm not the only person who has, for example, a late fee clause in my contract, if you pay me late, but I'll tell you what, if you talk to me the week before your payment is due and said, say, you know, my hours got cut back this week. Can we have an extra week on that payment? Or, you know, I actually had a client last month who was having trouble making the payment through my online portal and they emailed me and they said, Hey, I know this payment is due, but I can't get it to go through. And I was like, you know what, don't worry about it. Go and get a good night's sleep. Try it again tomorrow. If it's still not working. It was still not working. I will troubleshoot it on my end and I'm not gonna make you pay a late fee. You know, so it's. People are much more flexible. It just comes back to communication again. I think, you know, We we're, like I said, we are, we're all human people. He there's no bots making your wedding happen. And we're all very excited to do that for you and provide our services to you. And we want you to have the best friggin day ever. So if there's something we can do to make it better for you, just talk to us about it. And if you're struggling with. A payment or something that you need to do. Like, I sometimes have clients who just like, need a break from planning. And if I sit there and bug them every week and they don't reply to me, I'm like, Oh my God, are they dead in the side of the road in a ditch? Did something terrible happen? Do they suddenly hate me? And that want to work with me anymore? We're insecure. Lot. A bunch of us. I do. But if they just email me and say, you know what, I just. I can't right now. Can we just take a break from playing? I'm like, sure. I'll get you back in a couple of weeks, you know? So there's, there's communication just really is important and not just communication, but proactive communication. If there's something that, you know, your vendors expect of you or that you expect of your vendors and it's not being met. You know, don't run out and like, Smash us on social media. Like just pick up the phone and give us a call. Right. Yeah. Aye. We're all, we're all here. Most of us are online. You. I'm like Instagram, wherever they, you know, it's very easy to get ahold of people if you need. Sure. And figure out, you know, it's different than I think 10, 15 years ago. I didn't really hear from that person. And that is my photographer still alive. Like what's going on, right. I would think for the most part, it's a little different. Now, just in terms of like knowing what's going on with slightly. Yeah. Is there any other, before we let you go, any other talking points in that blog that we didn't hit on that you're like, this is a reads a dummy for not asking me. I'm just gonna scroll through real quick. Am all obviously linked to blogging. We'll include all that. I just want to make sure that anything. You know, to say it out loud. I think we, I think we pretty much covered it. You know, something that I've said a lot since I wrote this, this post, which really isn't. In any way addressed by it is that. This is not any of my clients, thankfully, because I have the best clans there ever have been. You all should be jealous of me and my awesome clients, but is, is I see a lot of people out there going like, well, my venues not going to let me have a wedding that complies with the current mandate. So does anybody have a private property? I can do it on instead. And I gotta tell you this really enrages me. Aye. I have been very flexible with my clients and very specific about what kind of weddings I'm going to take you because I care about public health. And I also care about remaining in business because I love what I do. And I am not going to risk my business license for you to have an event that's currently illegal. So I really wish that people would stop. That. Yeah. I would agree with that. I would agree that I, yes. Just. Then the thesis on those podcasts for a long time, it has been focusing on what you yeah. The things that we can do and not focusing on the things that you can't do. Right. Verbally example of that is like, can't do it here. So where can I? Yeah. Yeah, I always embrace it. What are the things you can do with the things that are allowed? And right now in Washington. Oh, I think we moved to phase two here in King County. To be honest, I don't have any weddings anytime soon. I sort of been like, not paying that close of attention to it. Lately, but I think we moved to phase two and I think that lets us have. A hundred or is it 200? It's crazy. It's 200. I think you can now have up to 200 or 25% capacity. Like you can have a wedding, you can have dancing. You just can't have everybody dancing at once. So you can send your group's up one table at a time. You can have multiple dance floor. Like there. Like you said earlier, there's only been that one very short period of time where you really couldn't have a wedding. And since then we've had everything from like five people to 200 people allowed and we've gone back and forth a few times between those extremes. But, but there are lots of things you still can do and you can still have a beautiful, wonderful wedding. It just might not be the one you had originally envisioned. And I will say that. Whether you realize it or not, almost every couple has already experienced and dealt with this phenomenon because. People come to a wedding saying I have X amount of dollars and that's budget. We'll do it every time and X amount of dollars. And that's how many dollars we're gonna spend at my wedding. And then a month later you found out how much weddings cost. And you have either found more money. Or you've changed your vision. And for most people it's going to be, you've changed your vision. And that's all we're doing here. We're saying the parameters that are what's available to you has changed this time. It's not number of dollars. It's number of guests. It's amount. Amount. Excuse me. It's the amount of people that can dance together at the same time. It's whether you can be inside the parameters have changed and you have to change your vision with it. If you want to still have a wedding. Yeah, I agree that we, I just was looking at my sheet. Yeah, we did 41 weddings last year. So don't please don't tell me that you can't get married right now in the, in the time, you know, it's like the movie I love in the time of cholera or whatever, right. Was that like, I actually never saw it, but I'll just pass it on. Like, I know what you're talking about. I love at the time of COVID, but no, but I mean that, you know, we did, we had four 40 weddings last year, all legal, everything, all that. So yeah, I don't. Yeah. Yes. Change the parameters. But don't change. Yes. I just echo that. Exactly. I only did three and two of them were elopements and the other one was before COVID hit. So a little different. For touring story on my end, but that one that shifted from 110 people in rural Wisconsin to a sunrise elopement in glacier national park. They're not sorry. I promise you. They're not sorry. They had a wonderful and exquisitely, beautiful wedding and, you know, Again, it's why we're all rolling with the punches here. And sometimes the punches are. Those that require you to change. Your assumptions and your ideals. To fit what's what's currently allowed. And that doesn't mean your wedding's going to suck. No, no. We're allowed to grow where we, I say we do an XFL podcasts. We're we're adults. We grow, we change. Opinions right. You better ourselves. So it's it's okay. To do that as my, your address, get blown out. Sydney. Thank you so much for coming on. I kind of dropped this on you. I said, Hey, you know, it's just on my mind that no, you have this great blog. We'll leave the blog and all that stuff. Where would you like people to know about you and the services you offer before we let you go? Oh, I am available pretty much everywhere at aisle less traveled, which is A I S L E L E S S T R A V E L E D or aislelesstraveled.com. And I'm on Facebook, Instagram. I have a Twitter account, which I rarely use. So that's. If you tweet at me, I'll notice it. But. Don't expect me to instigate, but I I'm. I'm pretty much everywhere. And yeah, you can contact me with any, in any of those, any of those avenues. Well, I so appreciate it. Yeah. And all linked to your good to know your wedding pro podcasts. We did just really you're hands on planning and really good, you know, have, have wedding planner will travel kind of mentality. And so for, yeah. We'll get back to that again. So. Thank you so much again for this. I hope this wasn't too much. Yeah, I hope this has more education than, than Erin dirty laundry. So I appreciate it. I didn't air any dirty laundry. So I don't want you to imagine. From my, I get in trouble sometimes on my, on my other podcast.

Episode 31 - You Can’t Dance If You Want To…

Well, thank you guys all so much for coming on today. You know, just to set the table a little bit, it seems to me, you know, Inslee and the regulations are coming out. Now you have vaccines. Weddings events, other things like that. And I have noticed a shift in the last week or two since Inslee kind of rolled out this first two step. You know, with vaccinations and everything. Honestly, there's probably not going to be large group dancing at weddings, at least in Washington this year. I know that we've been doing some things with, you know, first dances and everyone seated or, you know, the mother. Whatever people are seeing it, but this idea of the dance floor wedding thing that I think a lot of people, I know my weddings that postponed from last year. To now this year, and now we're sitting in January. Are already kind of coming to that realization, but also Alan and I were talking last night, you know, I am still getting inquiries very much so that are not phased at all for things to the summer. Which is also interesting. Right. And that's also part of the conversation. So. I just kinda wanted to get you guys on. We have three really good professional, smart, handsome in some cases more than others. DJ's. Yeah. I want to talk about this. I want to know what you guys think about this. Am I on the right track? You know, what's your couples be thinking about and whether some realistic things, right? Like what are we realistically? All last summer, it was okay. Well maybe by this point, maybe by this point, nothing ever changed. Nothing never. Right. We're still kind of at the same point. So that's kind of where I'm at. I want to see where the conversation goes to Jay. I'm genuinely excited about that. So why don't we just introduce ourselves and then I know Greg wants to start, but we'll, we'll introduce Sean and we'll go round and then we'll see where we're at. The Sean, who are you? Sean Whitmore here I am a DJ and master of ceremonies in Portland, Oregon area. And yeah, been at it for nearly 25 years and excited to join the conversation today. Thank you and Greg. Greg. None of these guys or any strangers. The podcast, but just for new listeners, Greg. I'm Greg louder with the bears. Do you remember entertainment in Seattle? And I'm a DJ MC and do lighting. And Alan s**t like. Hello. I'm Alan s**t like Puget sound. DJ is my company name. And I'm excited to be here. Thank you very much. So Greg, first off, I mean, just thoughts about this. I really just wanted to have a conversation today and wherever that goes. So when you hear all this. You know, where are we out? Am I off base in what I'm thinking? No. I mean, I'll be honest. My crystal ball has been very foggy for about a year now, but I think the writing is on the wall is that we don't see open dancing in the majority of. Washington. What do they call them now? Hospital districts. Until 20 to 2022. And, and I. You know, there might be some of the outscoring ones. Or outlying ones that are come around and get some of the things up there. And as far as the numbers that are hit, there's the four benchmarks that everybody has to hit, but. Now I will be honest. I'm the definitions of phase one and two will probably be out later this week, early next week. Here we are in the middle of January. But the base three and phase four, from what I understand, rules have not been written yet. So. Whether that means phase three gets a little bit open dancing or phase four does. I don't know, but there's some, I believe some fear of a sweaty dance floor. And understandably so. I mean, I, you know, It's probably not the safest place to be and not get breathed on. Alan, you participated a lot in the, in the Facebook groups and a lot of, you know, moderating and seeing what a lot of couples and everything. What have you noticed and seen recently since kind of this new. You know, two-step thing came out. I think there has been constant apprehension on the. The case of most couples about what's going to happen because the wedding season is so compressed here, basically June through September, you had 20, 20 couples. Move to 2021, but that all took a lot of hemming and hawing and I dunno what we're gonna do and what it's going to be like. And that kind of thing for a while we all thought. 2021. We're in the clear, no problem. This is all going to be eradicated by then. But if you look at the graphs, Things are really, really bad right now. And. People are seeing that and the government is responding to that. So I do think there's a lot of questions from a lot of couples. There are. People who are newly engaged, who are. There seem to be skipping 2021 altogether in favor of 2022. And then couples who perhaps had postponed already. Thinking that 2021 would be safe. And what are we going to do now? Like, are we going to try and. Stay within the guidelines. Are we going to wait another year? You know, people have to decide. There's a lot of challenges. Yeah. Shell, where do you fall on this? And whether it be in your thoughts kind of see and everything, obviously, you know, you're, you're in Portland, I would say similar mindset to Seattle. And then also you, you do a lot of. You know, work talking with all the officials and stuff as well, kind of in that role. So where do you come down on all this? Well, I don't like Allen or Greg at all. And I don't like what they're saying at all. I. It's just the reality of what we're dealing with. This uncertainty. Is certainly real and real for a reason with the case rise. And I do some work with Leo, which is the live events industry of Oregon, and we're becoming LEC alive events. Coalition. A chapter of an Oregon will have a chapter. What we've heard federally is that we're expected to do mitigation through September. And the hope is that when we get to October that the social distancing, the masking. And a lot of those elements will start to be able to go away. I think mainly on that vaccination, you know, projections, which right now we just know are simply projections and we're falling really far short right now. Of sort of the modest schools that were set. And I think there's a bit of optimism and hope that with this new administration, steadying side, all politics that maybe we can go ahead and get vaccines on track. If we can hit Biden's. You know, It kind of high end goals of 100 million vaccinated. Maybe that October date is realistic, but if we're being truthful with ourselves, you know, it's, it's a projection and we don't know if we can get the production and distribution and the shots in the arm. In the manner in which our federal government is saying we can. And so with that, that leaves couples with not knowing. And if they don't know, they're not going to move forward or they're going to postpone. Or they're going to cancel. So it puts us with our backs once again. Once again against the wall. With clients, the normal interactions that you and I have with our clients that all of us have, have been greatly altered by this pandemic. And I, for one, want to return to the person I was with my clients. And not the person I am currently with my clients with regards to contracted language, postponements, cancellations, refunds, money forward, and all those things. So I, I have high hope. I remain an optimist and think that we can get through this. We are Americans, and I think we have the strength in numbers to be able to get it done. If we can just align and set aside everything else and focus on this one task, getting people back to work, getting 10 million live events, people back to doing events. Yeah. And it's it's. The timeline that you set is I think so important, especially for the Pacific Northwest weddings here, where you say, you know, By October. Right? Well, you know, I, I don't speak for you guys, but I know that, you know, my event calendar, you know, is may really till November 1st. I mean, except for, you know, the scattered weddings or whatever in. You know, December, January, so, you know, brides and grooms out there that are listening. This is my hope today is to have this conversation and into just what I've tried to do, you know, week by week is, you know, I just, these expectations. You know, to what is going on and what is it going to look like? Because yeah, the projection is we're going to be set by the end of October. Well, if you've got a wedding in August and it's not, and that's, you know, that's even the best case scenario, right? I mean, if you're looking for an October wedding and maybe it's, it's, it's a mess still through January, you know? I mean, we don't, I don't think anybody thought that we would be here. Literally a year. I KOMO news just did a story on Sunday and it's a year to the date from like the first, you know, contracted yeah. Though, case that we had in Kirkland out like the nursing home. So. I don't think anybody realized that. So. That'll all be INSEAD. Alan, what, you know, what. We've talked about this a lot, not to beat the horse. But, you know, what am I thinking now? If I'm a couple and I have a date and then I want to get into the new inquiries to, but if I, if I have a couple of. I have a date. You know, July 17th this year. Why am I thinking. Well, I think you start by what is your history? If you have gone through a postponement already. And you're in July, you are probably a little bit shell shocked still from all of the, that, that entailed. And you have probably been engaged for a more significant amount of time, and therefore you may feel more pressure to get on with it, to get married. Regardless of what you get to do. You know, and, and the. The the, if you, if you have to limit your activities at your wedding or limit the guests at your wedding, If you have been engaged for two years. You, you probably may just feel some more pressure. To do that. If you are newly engaged, You possibly feel a little bit more. Like I can wait this out. I can see what's going to happen. And I can probably adjust in terms of. Guest count. People who are getting married in July. Still have plenty of time to make adjustments. If they're going to keep on with their date, they could still. Oh, shrink their guests list if they need to by then. So I don't think there's too many action items. Right now for a couple, other than to kind of examine their own mindset and their own values. And what's important to them. Is a big celebration. Important to them. What's their risk tolerance. What are the policies of their venue of their vendors? Like, you know, what, what are the implications for them? Of moving out again. I know for people who were supposed to get married in 2020 and their vendors, We're all sick of it. I mean. Every couple who's gone through it and it has to write these notes. Are you available on these, any of these three dates and find out what is your cancellation policy? What's your postponement policy. It's a drag and weddings shouldn't be a drag. That should be fun. No. I mean, unless Sean is your DJ, but in general, you really want. You know, you want to be able to anticipate that your wedding is going to be fun and planning. It should be fun. Yeah, we, I just had an email over the weekend. Was our Memorial day, weekend couple last year. And I remember, you know, in April, Carly messaged me and said, what are we doing? And I think I've taught that. You know, part of this, around this, on the podcast before I said, Oh, it's, you're fine. It's not even a concern. Right? And then we can postpone from, you know, may of last year to may of this year. And I just, over the weekend, she said, Hey, you know, is there like an access pioneer square? You know? So it's like a good. You know, like a good real venue. And they said, Hey, you know, they're giving us a backup date and we, in case we need it in, in like October, November, right. Just to be able to shift it. But now, like we said, even talking with Sean, you know, That still might not be good enough. You know what I mean to go. And now here you've postponed. So Greg, what are your thoughts on all this? So two things, one interesting. You picked July 17th is your example date, because that was the first. 21 couple. I had that pushed to 22. Already pushed. Yeah. And they had not changed it this day. Where one that book late last year. They pushed to next year. And then today. New inquiry for July 17th this year. So, I mean, On one hand, I'm going sweet. You know, on the other hand, I'm going. Maybe, but here's something interesting. Before argued the Washington state legislature yesterday and today. Had a, had a bill that they were discussing. And. The proposal was to put all the comps. Hospital districts in the state of Washington automatically to phase two. And it had more 1600 people signed up to testify for it, which is the most they've ever had for any bill ever. And so. They're the thought being, because if you look at the rules with, with the going from the different phases, now they readjusted everything. You know, like we talked about for Inslee a couple of weeks ago. But basically there were the four characteristics. Everybody had a hit to go up a phase, but there's only two. That you have to go negative on to go down. So would this gives people the opportunity is, is to maintain. You know, a level two. Or if they really have a bad time, you know where there's so many ICU cases, there's so many testing, all that stuff. They'll drop back down to phase one. So if that actually passes and gets the bipartisan support and really just kind of, you know, cause Inslee will probably veto. Is the, is the call. And then I got an override him, but if they can do that, The main thing it does. And this is what will come out later this week, or, or next week is weddings have been, have been. Like, I'm trying to think of the word, like picked on is it sounds like I'm in third grade, but basically. Said, Hey, everything, you can do all the events of this way, unless you're a wedding. And or a funeral. And if you're that, then you can only do this. And so the main thing that this will do is align. The amount of people you've been have to restaurants and other events. Cause in my opinion and, and, and that's gonna start at 25%. And so, in my opinion, though, People at a restaurant. Are are people at a wedding reception are much safer off than people at, at a restaurant because at a wedding reception, you know, every single person there. You they're on a list you can spread out and set up anything you want. And instead of just having random people show up in a restaurant at different times, walking by you at a wedding reception, we can plan everything as we all do. To the minute. And, and keep everybody away from each other. So it's a much more safer things. So like picking on us and saying, Oh, weddings in the band. For whatever reason, which the data does not support as far as case numbers go. So if they align what we're doing with, with, with everything else. It'll make everything easier. And then as you go to the different phases, they'll just have to address the percentages and not like the number of people. And all that stuff. It's so interesting. How you sit with the restaurants. I mean back either months ago, when, when they were open. I, you know, at the, at the capacity. Yeah. Dorothy and I would go, we'd be sitting there and someone would walk by and not have their mask on. And you know, like you're sitting, but walking in the bathroom. You know, air. You know, a walkway and you're like, come on, you know, like what's going on. But like you said, Is that also, and I'm asking this for my own. Is the idea behind that also. Just setting a baseline that we know is going to be okay. Cause I think the problem with the weddings is people, okay, we can do 50 people or 30 people. We can do all this, but what if that drops down? Right. I think people are always worried about that. Am I, am I wrong in thinking that. Like, I want to know the minimum that we can have and we'll just stay there. Is that kind of the thought behind it? It's a fear because you know, right now with, with us not being aligned and they might adjust those numbers on phase one. But if you, right now, you can't have anything indoors. Right. And so. If you are. If we're all at phase one, we're going to sit there. But if they bumped us to phase two, in theory, two weeks before your wedding, they could tell you, now you're back down to 30 people. And what, if you were in a venue that, you know, you're 25% is a hundred people. You know, we've got some big ballrooms to in town. Would work. Great. For having a large amount of people. And, and my, my thing was you could go put. You know, they could, they were only allowed to have 25 people at the Tacoma dome. For a wedding. I mean, come on. That doesn't make sense. I mean, So percentages really makes sense. I mean, you have them there, it's a legal thing with the fire code. What a great thing to be able to manage and to keep safe. So, but you're right. The fear of going up. Or tha tha tha tha enjoying going up is great, but the fear of coming down is going to be. You know, we're going to be crossing our fingers there, and that's a great thing for us or, or challenges. What happens if it's two weeks out and now it's illegal to have that wedding that we were supposed to do. Yeah, cause I mean, in China, I want to get your thoughts on this. Cause I mean, you know, we all lived through that here in Washington and I don't know quite what the timeline was like and where you're at. But I mean, we, we had weddings where, you know, it was like that last week of July. Right. And they said everything, you know, August 6th or whatever on. And we all, everyone had weddings eighth, ninth, and then of course, like the next day they postpone. Yeah. Okay, well, it'd be after that weekend, which made no sense, you know, but like, it is a very real thing where, you know, a couples are sitting right now and they're playing. I mean, we had, it was, it was three days before, right. It wasn't like the Thursday for the Saturday and they, they, they made that call. So I thoughts on all this and just kind of be in certainty and. Yeah, we were, we've been a singled out, I think was where Greg was trying to get. We've been singled out industry. For much of this and what we're seeing in Oregon and kind of what we're saying. As our lobby body there for live events is we do need to align, like Greg said, with the restaurant model. I think the fear is that you spend an hour at a restaurant and you spend four to six hours at a wedding. So you're gathering time, goes up substantially at a wedding or a corporate event. And so that's where they let the fear overcome, but who better in this world? Honestly, then event planners, event coordinators, people like us to do this in a manner which it can be safely done. I mean, Had they contracted the 10 million out of work at bet workers to distribute the vaccine. I know for a fact, we have enough smart people. We could have figured out a solution to help with that process, for sure, because there are so many organized. And creative people and that's what we do. We're all creatives. We all think out of the box, we all are solutionists we all come up with ways to overcome the obstacles that face us, and then to deliver this experience, like no other. For our clients, whether that's a small, intimate wedding, a big wedding. It's small corporate, huge corporate, whatever it is in whatever space. We adapt and overcome. And so we needed our federal government to do more of that with this vaccine distribution. And so I think. We're definitely headed in the direction. Oregon has been just a tick, less locked down than Washington, but basically, you know, California, Oregon, Washington are fairly aligned with restrictions. You know, I think it's 50 people you can do an event for right now in Oregon. You guys, it's just a ceremony, only no reception, right? For Washington. Now you can do a receptionist, 30 people. Out of 30 people. Okay. Okay. So, you know, we're, we're fairly aligned there. I think where we're headed is as the vaccine gets out, I think we're gonna see our numbers go like 5,100, one 50, as far as what's allowed. Now, what that looks like when you're at a wedding and reception with regards to masks and social distancing. Those are the pieces that I think what I'm looking for from my couples, especially previously impacted couples. Is, can we take this journey? Can we do it together? Can we find a way to still let you celebrate? And work within the allowable parameters, as difficult as that might be. You're you're either delaying again. Or you're asking the most impacted industry to reach back into their pocket, to reach back into a fund that they're feeding their families. They're paying themselves a modest amount of money to keep paying their mortgage. You're asking us to literally take money. We don't have out of our back pocket and give it back to people. And it's just a lot to ask of an industry that's going to be impacted when this all is all said and done to close to two years. And so I'm just trying to see if there's any way. We can work together to try to have a modified celebration that is still fun. Engaging and, you know, delivers the two of them married. Yeah. I mean, and, and they, you know, goodness for 'em. You know, reappear and you know, some of the PPP and some of these things now, you know, and I know that I'm someone that, you know, partook in that because, you know, It was March. And then now, you know, finally we got, but it's, you know, it's. For all small businesses, especially the events were East. So it's not like we're living like this big margin business. Right. Where we're, I mean, it's a, it's a ton of time and money. And like you said, trying to do those refunds. Alan, you had a comment. I was going to come to you anyway. Don't worry. I just wanted to say one piece of optimism that I want to offer in this is that I feel like the Washington governor's office at least has learned. From what has happened in the past as they began creating these standards, I'm not sure they even cared about the wedding industry or had any discussions with anybody who was in the wedding industry. And probably the example that you mentioned. In late July. You are going to end weddings in. What was it? Eight. Days and snip off. August 8th and ninth. I, you know, the biggest, maybe the, probably the biggest weekend of the year, like that just tells me that they really didn't have anyone giving them information about what's realistic in the wedding industry. But now. They've got Greg and a group of other people who they're listening to. And so I feel like the example that you gave before about maybe we slip back. I think they understand how devastating that would be for some people, if they had to just adjust. So negatively. So I, I, I feel like we're at least top, not top of mind, but in. In the discussion now. Yeah. I mean, because, and I know the same went for like the restaurants where I would see a lot where, you know, it was supposed to go back up on like Sunday. A bunch of people would get food and stuff. Ready. They go, okay, well actually it's going to be next week or something like, well, we can't, I can't just open the restaurant, you know, overnight and just have everything ready to go. Greg. I want to talk about, you know, The people that are still going to be getting married now. You know, this is not an unknown. Now, what does a wedding look like in 2020, 20, 21 yet we know what they look like. We have still captured, you know, I don't know, 35, 40 wonderful wedding celebrations this last year, you know, safely and everything else. I mean, what, what, in your opinion, what do those weddings look like him? I mean, obviously there's still, you know, worthwhile and wonderful to have, because I think I want, you know, people shouldn't be there shouldn't be like a fear of an unknown, but there also needs to be at like a acknowledgement of like, what is actually happening right now at these weddings. Let me answer it and just say, I want to clarify some Allen to just let you know, Allen, the group had actually been working with the, the governor's office since April. And so I didn't get, I become a part of it until July or August. And so. Oh, that's when it got good. When you join. I just list. That's all I listen and I get to put on DJ stuff and that's kind of fun. But no. The problem with it was that was, they've been talking to them and working with them. And then they basically had it kind of a knee-jerk reaction to some of the numbers. And so. They don't ask our opinion or whatever then they do now. And, and, and, and we got to right. The new wedding proposal. You know, rules and stuff, but then they get to edit them however they want. So they don't send them back to us or anything like that. It's just like, well, here's our thoughts. And so we'll see what happens. We don't know. And, but you also have, as you mentioned, a lot of people who aren't necessarily. In this business. I'm trying to do it. You know, and, and I always use the example is one of the first things they let happen again, was car sales. In like June or something like that. After they sh we had the shutdown and everything and they put back in and go, Hey, we're all you can go buy a car. Well, there was nothing in the, in the rules about being on the do test. Correct. So then also. Oh, well, you can do test drives. You know, and that's fine, but you'd think that seems obvious. But it wasn't until, so going forward, really to answer your question stuff. I do think that there's a lot of stuff. We can do an in one thing and I know. Having known and, and, and talk with Alan and Sean for a number of years. The thing that's important to a lot of us is really making that day. Personal for our hospitals. And so in the past, maybe we. You know, a third of the night or two and a half the night was, was kind of working on that dance playlist or, or kind of going through all that sort of stuff. And that's a personal aspect of them, but it's also, it can be everything else too. And so I think it gives us this great opportunity to. Just be open and honest. Okay. Here's what it is. And the other thing I've always tried to do is you have a plan and you have a schedule, but you also have those kind of, if then's. And so we might come up with four or five, six things that they're okay with, you know, and, and, and, and that we break out if we need to under certain circumstances. Well, we might have to come up with 10 of those things. And for every couple is different in a guarantee you one we'll pick some, it's just like music. Whenever the favorite song is of one couple will be on the, do not play list of another couple. And that's cool. So it's just, this might be, instead of, it might add a full, additional planning meeting. I mean, that's, that's cool. We sit down, we talk, we come up with what it is that they want to do. That's different. And unique and interpretation, you know? I don't know about you guys, but it seemed to me that the cake cutting. Had been kind of, not as popular over the last four or five, six years. Well, now it's allowed, it's literally in the roles that we're allowed to do. And even when they had the ceremony, you can do the cake cutting ceremony only. So maybe we need to come up with like a super elaborate Mark barrel esque sort of cake cutting ceremony, as Mark would say, this is a, a DJ guru, a friend of ours. And. And come up with something super elaborate. I don't know. I mean, If it's allowed, why not? Yeah, I think it's, it's tricky because. It's still couples that, that want to do things the way it was before. Right. And, and it it's, I have a similar conversation. Last year, you know, with a lot of like self-employed people and getting unemployment and all these other things. But I said, you know, being, being self-employed, I view as a privilege, right? Like I view that as, as being, you know, not having, and it's fine to go into the office and all that, but you know, being able to work from home is a privilege for me. Right. And being able to have a, a large wedding with a big dance party, you ever, I mean, that's a, that's a privilege, right? I mean, that's not an expectation, right. We, I have my football podcast that I do. And we early on, we were really into the COVID stuff and everything. You know, it's, you know, sports is like the benefit of like a functioning society, right. Because everyone's safe and we're all doing everything we're able to like, go watch like NFL games or whatever. Right. And this the same thing with dancing, right? It's not just a given that we'll just because I want to get married. I'm going to have 300 people and all this stuff. And you know, I mean, it's a, we can certainly get back to that, but it's not. Like, that's not an expectation. Right. But it does seem like that's like a right, right. Am I, am I saying that right? You guys do? I mean, Sean, what do you, what do you think about that? Yeah, I, I think. We're in a spot where we're doing a bit of sort of education or reeducation. People and getting them to understand. That yes. Dancing is a piece of your wedding, but there's still other elements that you can highlight that you can incorporate that are part of the day. That you know, can, can be part of it. And maybe I've seen, you know, some of your DJs up there doing those socially distant. You know, pod dances. I don't know how that's going, but is that a solution for a place that has an outdoor venue to create pods? We've seen these concerts setups where they have these. Containment zones. We're a group that it has agreed to be together. You know, can stay in their pod. So. Can we be solution finders? Can we get creative? Can we. Adjust what we're our norms and create some new norms for people and just figure out a way to adapt and overcome to the circumstances that we all know are here. Right there. Here, we have to live with them with however long this, this goes on and, and. Who's to say, you know, that 20, 22 doesn't bring something different or new that's going to cause another pivot, adjustment, rethinking. I think. You know, the one thing that I learned early on at 21. Was listening to a professor, literally say to me, and I struggle with this and I still struggle. But he said that the only constant in life is change. And I think we're at a spot right now where people are very inflexible. Politically personally, professionally, and they're just not willing to adapt and change. I think as a society, as a whole, as, as Americans, we need to change. We need to change our perspectives. We need to change our thoughts. We need to change our attitudes about our friends that have different political views about our family members that have different political views. And in general about what we're talking about, about weddings, we need to change what was to something new and it doesn't have to mean it's not great. It's just different. Yes. Talking about their creative pivots. I really like that. I mean, I know Alan, they call you creative Chitlin on the side to see yourself. Good at. You know, trying to even like, I make the joke that I'm actually getting into it. Like, for example, the anniversary, the answer, right? You are someone that has, you know, thoughts about that and you go out of your way to make a anniversary dance, right. That that's, you're not kicking a couple off to the side. Right? I'm saying this right. I'm speaking truth. When it comes to creativity for, for these weddings and things like Sean's talking about these pivots, what are your thoughts on that? And I know that you have conversations with your couples about like how to still get the best they can out of things. Sure. Well, I think part of the way that you, if you're a couple can start to think of this. Is if, if I, if somebody came to my wedding and there was no dancing, could they still have fun? Could they still feel like it was our wedding. And if the answer is, you know, if you're really on the fence about whether that the answer is yes. If you kind of go, I don't know. I just, every, every wedding that we've enjoyed. Has been a rock in two and a half hour dance party. Then 2021 is not your answer. Right. It must not have hired Alan for that one. Yes. Yes. But if you say sure. Our wedding can be fun. It can be a great time for us to get the people who are close to us together. And get them all under the same roof. Then start from that, start from that idea of we're going to make it personal to us. We're going to share the fact that we're in love and we're committing ourselves to each other. We're going to share that with the people that we really care about. And we're going to take steps. To make it personal, even if the end of the night doesn't involve dancing. So there are many activities that the good DJs can help suggest that will, that will bring out the personalities of the couple and just keep the entertainment factor at a fairly high level, even if there isn't dancing. So I think. Couples have to just think about that mindset. Can they adjust? Are they able to. Be happy with the kind of wedding that 2021 is probably going to present. If they can be satisfied with that, then go for it. Make sure you, you were working with somebody that you, that you trust to pull the stuff for you. If not, if you, if you really are focused on that dance party, then don't look back, get the, get their 20, 22 and call it. Good. Yeah. And even, and I know, and Greg correct me if I'm wrong. I think in the regulations now, right. You can still do like the first dance people see it as right. Mass. You know, like a father, a father, daughter, and all that. And, and I, you know, I've even seen some comments about that. Like, well, that's gotta be weird and that's gotta be awkward. And like, it's really not. I mean, it all, like we filmed down, you know, The same way you would do like a grand entrance if people would be, see that. It's really not awkward at all. Right. And, and something that struck me too. And this is obviously. Yeah. With DJs here, it's weird. Right? Because I think people look at DJs and they think of, you know, dance party, whatever, you know, there's so many other things that are facilitated and, and part of the reception, you know, toast, grand entrance, you know, I know like Alan and the shoe games and things. You know, the cake hiding all these other things are facilitated. Right. And I just edited. Last week wedding. Alan. And I had done from like two years ago, long story short, but they just, it, she had never the bride who never would ever, and I edited this wedding from like a different world. Right. They're like doesn't even exist anymore. And what struck me about it. Is how little of the actual dance party. You know, Really. I mean, it's obviously it's a huge part of the day, but like, I think people envision it as like, well, that was 80% of the wedding. Right. And it's not, there's so many other things from the ceremony and there, and the toast and the, you know, the cake cutting and the getting ready and the family photos and all these other things that like, it's not the be all end, all that you can't have 45 minutes of open dancing at the end of your wedding. Right. I mean, am I, are you guys feeling great? Do you feel what I'm saying here? I have, I, it's funny as I've gone through all this, I'm thinking back to the weddings I've done in the past before 2020. They didn't have dancing and I've I'm I. Two hours at the end of the night. And there's not a lot, you know, you, you work on the playlist and he'd do all that, but. You know, we're professionals. We kind of know if you play song and that song bees probably going to work and where people are at. And in these ones, we went from doing. You know what nine. The regular nine to 12, you know, kind of events throughout the reception. You know, we were doing. 15 to 20. And, and going through and just getting really creative one. I had a. A fifth grade teacher. So we played a big, long game of, are you smarter than a fifth grader? The funny part of that, that one was, as we were going through the questions I realized how difficult they were. So we actually use second grade questions. I didn't make that decision in the moment I made that decision because I looked at the questions and was like, Nan, and that have these aren't going to work. You know, so, but we had a good time and, and you know, if it's this summer, you don't think about, so this particular wedding and we had planned out a bunch of stuff, but again, this becomes the stuff kind of the, if then where I'm keeping stuff in my pocket and kind of break in and out as we need to. We were at new castle in the tent. And it was one of those nights where the sunset wasn't was, was like a two hour long sunset. And so people would go out and watch the sunset. And Neil Hubbard was out playing in his bank pipes and it was just gorgeous. But there was clouds. And so it was the sun was going down the clouds kind of, kind of dissipating a little bit. And it was one of those nights where it started early and ended late. And people just kind of came in and out and we were just doing stuff. So. It was, I, it was lucky for me, but it was one of those kind of Epic Nikes that you look back on. And I bet you only two or three people that were, I think they were teenagers or were like, Are we going to dancing? Everybody else was just thoroughly entertained and had a good time. And that brings up an interesting point. Do you talk about the elephant in the room or not? Cause I don't want people to feel like they're disappointed. Or do you just keep them so entertained that they don't even think about it? I don't know. Denzel the couple, I guess. So, where do you land on that? Yeah. I mean all, all good points. And the reality is like Greg said, we each have a couple every year that for whatever reasons, maybe choose not to have dancing as. Part of their evening. And I think. Most people, you know, Can have fun. I think if the opportunity presents and it's guided in a way that they feel like they can. Access the activity or observe the activity and a guy like Elon, a guy like Greg. Can make these moments come to life. The way that they're presented by having an understanding of what our couples are looking for, who they are and what can help highlight why we're all there. But let's remember. We've gathered to see these two people get married. Kick their lives off together with a party. Now what that party looks like is different for every single couple, but typically we end the celebration with some kind of dancing anywhere from one hour to three or four hours, depending on who you are. I had five and a half hours the other night for 20 people. But I mean, that's the only one I've ever had. That was five and a half hours. They're normally like two hours. And as a DJ, honestly like five and a half hours as far too much, like. I'm spent and exhausted. So, you know, those two and the two and a half hour dance sets are fantastic, but I think there are a number of things we can do and present to our couples that will highlight them that will, you know, Fill the time with meaningful activity. That will leave people saying. Wow, that that was different. And then kind of, almost like Greg alluded to there's sort of like trying to figure out why was it different? And then they look back and go. It was so good. They don't even remember. We didn't dance. That's what was different, like, but it's only in reflection because you still engage them in a way that brought everybody together and let them have a good time. And almost just forget that dancing wasn't part of it. I don't think they're going to recognize it in the moment. I think they're going to recognize it in reflection when we need new couples that go I'm hiring Greg, Greg killed this party and nobody danced. That's how great a DJ. He was like, he killed it and nobody can. So I think you're going to see it in 2022. And, and later when couples come to you to book you and say, Man that was so Epic. You did that with no dancing. I can't imagine if we could actually have that piece in there as well. Before we go, I want to. And Alan, and I think we're talking about this last night, you know, the new inquiries now, right? So, I mean, obviously we have the couples that are getting, you know, They're already engaged there. They'd be there. Postponed or like Greg has one that you picked this year and now it's postponing, but I still, I had two consults yesterday. You know, one was a live stream for a wedding, but then the other was I get normal wedding in July. I had a call the other day. I said, yeah, he would just, I hate these cold calls, like, Hey, tell me about your wedding with everybody. But I said, you know, generally we try to, you know, where they're eight to 10 hours, obviously it's different right now, you know, because everything's kind of shifted. He goes, Oh, well, we're going to be our venues. Not going to care. We're going to do. Like it's, you know, we're going to be down in Chehalis. Like it doesn't matter. And I was like, Oh, okay. So. Point being, you know, three or four ago, like last four or five I've had still are very much like we're just planning the wedding this year. Right. And so I guess, where is that divide coming? I'm very confused by that because I really did. I think Alan and I. I was trying to remember which podcast it was, if it was the like, Preparing for ti. One of the ones that we did, we talked about this and we said, well, surely everybody's on the same page now that we know that this is like a thing and we're not, but it's really not. And I'm still really getting a lot of calls. So where does it, who wants to start? Where is that divide coming from? Greg. Yeah. I had one the other day and talked to her pretty extensively and, and. You know, Brought it up. And as we kind of went through the different things in her. You know, Quote was no, one's going to have it. No one's wearing any mask at my wedding. And, you know, I can understand that she said she wasn't, or he wasn't or something like that. I mean, you know, I did my. I don't know whenever they were legal. Again, one of mine that Brian had a very Lacy mass that matched her dress. I thought that was kind of cool. But she said, I don't care if my vendors do. And so I just had a Frank conversation with her about it and stuff. I know some people would have been okay, no problem. And other people would have been, Oh, well, you know, you're not my client, a client or whatever, you know, would it just kind of gotten off the phone, but I decided I would just have a big, long conversation with her about it. And he was interesting to see your motivation, who was not everybody was from the same area. This was a private property place and it just was. You know what she wanted to do. And in the end, I'll be honest. I quoted her such a high price, so there's no way she'll book me, but I didn't want to. You know, I just kinda gave her a through a, through a number out there with her and we'll see. But. It's it's just such a tough thing. I mean, would I show up if I knew everybody wasn't wearing a mask? Or would I book it? I'd be wearing one. I'd make sure it's outside in the field and I'm really far away from everybody. But then that leads to the open dancing, or if they're going to break the mass school, are they going to do open dancing? I can't, I wouldn't really go straight against that. You know if it's, if it's outright banned, so. I guess it's everybody's personal. Prerogative. Or. Something, Alan, I saw you pull out some notes. I think you have a good followup here. I saw you shuffling papers. I was shuffling some notes from the last five couples I chat with and chatted with, and their dates are June 26th. July 3rd, July 25th. August 13th. And I talked to a couple yesterday about October 9th and. You are right. In my opinion, most of these people. Are presuming that we're going to be funny. And I think part of that. Is just this whole idea of how long can this freaking virus go on? Like our time. Yeah, I don't think any of us could have even believed we would have this wave, this bad. In year two, we're where we are. So I think there's an element to which. And it still feels a long way off for some of these people, July and August. Feel like months away and they feel like, okay, well we've got the vaccine, we've got some good news coming. And I don't necessarily feel like that. The restrictions that the governor's office. Is putting out are particularly well communicated. You know, you have to, you have to, you have to kind of dig or know somebody or beyond some, some groups that are full of informed people. So I, I think that's where the disconnect comes from is that. People want to have that Puget sound. Sunny, July, August wedding. They crave it. It's because it's so great. I'm rare. And rare. So. I don't know. I think. You know, pod there's podcast. Hopefully we'll educate some people to open up their eyes and look, look at those, some of the restrictions and make decisions about how that could impact them and what they want to do about that. One quick, one quick note, before we go to Sean, I just remember this because Alan, we were on whether the last podcast I did, we did an in 2020 was, you know, the 20, 21 wedding right in the vaccine or whatever. And then we did the vendors and we had all these vendors come on and talk about you. How are we feeling about 20, 21 wedding season with the vaccine? And then the next week I did a follow-up with all couples. And I said, Hey, you know, cause there was a lot of reaction to, you know, some people will postpone and some people didn't, whatever. And I had a bride on and she either she came on and she goes, absolutely not. We're not postponing. This is what we're doing. Like we're we are set in stone. Last week, you know, I see her posts online in the same group, like, Hey, so we're rescheduling, you know, looking for whether you plan on there for next year. Right. And not to. Not to, not to, you know, shame or make fun or whatever, but right. I mean, Like Sean said earlier, you know, I change and being flexible on things, but I mean, this was just, you know, end of December, right? I mean, this is probably wasn't even a month ago. Right. And this is how things. Are changing. And so, you know, if you have couples that were that dead set on it a month ago, that she said, I'm going to go on the podcast because I am someone that's advocating for doing it this summer, and nothing will change my mind. And then. It was like three, three and a half weeks later. They're changing that. I mean, that is how quick, you know, cause I know a lot of people that wouldn't be that strong enough. Like, you know, sit down on a podcast to like, talk about their feelings about it, Matt strong, over regard. Do you get what I'm saying? Shell. What do you, what do you think about that? Yeah. So lately for me, it's been a. A book, one lose one game, which we all know is it's a losing game for our industry. It's not a great model. The events that we, we did have were postponements. So they're already tying up important dates in 2021. They're now wanting to move the new ones that booked in late during the pandemic for 2021. And haven't been impacted yet are now starting to be impacted and make decisions about dates. May June, July, August to shift to 2022. And then you have the people that you're all discussing that are the eternal optimist. The glass is always full. That are booking now for dates near like, you know, in the next six months, eight months. And I think if you have those Frank conversations that there there's a pandemic afloat. If everybody's looking around, right. It's here. It's not going anywhere. So just with that reality in mind. You're booking this date with the understanding that you're going to scale and do what's allowed within the parameters of that date. Because none of us are in the game of book now. You know, hold the day clear date, pushed a new date, you know, cancel then. Like that's not the game that we're in. The dates are. The inventory, the dates are the critical element here. And I think there's a big disconnect with clients. Understanding how valuable our inventory is. Yeah. Unlimited Allan alluded to earlier. I always tell people we have 18 to 20 prime weekends in the Pacific Northwest 18 to 20 prime dates that everybody's after. Cause they want to know why, why are you so expensive? Like, well, I've got limited data availability. Everybody wants these 18 to 20 Saturdays. And so they have a premium price, you know, to have them. So. I like the optimism. I'm scared if I'm being honest about the clients that are not giving any opportunity to scale to what's allowed for July and August and September it's concerning. You know, [unknown]. Will be helpful, but it will be gone quickly. Like [unknown]. One was, you know, and so, you know, like you guys, I I'm living on a government loan, you know, the idol, the economic injury, disaster loan. So, you know, Savings gone, you know, the money's gone and I'm living on money that I have to repay. So my hope is that people can understand that the pandemic has had massive impact and. You know, either scale to what's allowed or understand, you know, refunds are difficult. Cancellations or are impossible. And, you know, let's try to work together and make it happen. Yeah. I mean, the good news is, and then we'll get final thoughts here. I, you know, There was a lot of conversations. You March, April, whatever about, you know, changing contracts and adding all this stuff. What are we going to do that? I mean, I really didn't do anything. You know, we kind of handled them case by case, and now I've never had to change the contract because you know, the policies that are in place now. I mean, you know, what's going on, we are not canceling these dates, you know, we can, we can reschedule and we can go down that route or we can reduce coverage. But yeah, there is no cancellations of any kind, especially now where everything is known. I mean, You know, we can do a reschedule fee or waive that if it's, you know, you're moving to a Tuesday or whatever, but I mean, It's theirs. That's not existent anymore. And I think that, I don't know if that's the mindset that people have that are booking these and they all, well, we can just we'll we'll cancel or were we had one. For a live stream the other day, and they were bounced around a couple of dates. And I just had a post by Greg. I just had a postponement. And so I said, wow, that'd be great to fill that. But I said, please make sure that, you know, that that's the date that you, you know, if you need to take a week because they're just doing it like an Airbnb really small, it's just like, you know, it's like in the low amount, like six people on the livestream, I said, cause. We worked the day, but then we can just move it. Cause you guys felt like doing it on the June 1st versus May 22nd or whatever. Right? I mean, these are like, you guys said these are valuable inventory. Final thoughts before we go. Like I said, I know that there wasn't like any, a checking point of things to get through today. I just kind of wanted to hear where everybody is and I mean, this is fulfilled my expectations of what I was looking to have. So I appreciate that. I don't know what sometimes Allen's a tougher critic on us then, than I am, but why don't we start with Sean final thoughts and we'll go around and we'll ended up with Allen. Thank you so much for coming on today. And you know, it's not these aren't fun conversations all the time. Now I was hoping to see Greg braid Allen's back here. I thought that was what was happening on this podcast. I'm not sure what. He shaved it before the call. So we don't. Okay. I totally. I misread that I misread that. Totally. So this is why they invented editing software read. I need my, I need my XFL of Mark CASSE soundboard. Right now we have one that's like, wow. I don't mean to throw off his editing. I think into recap, my hope is that to, to the clients that might listen to this and to the couples that are out there in any state really is. Talk with your vendors, talk with your vendors. They're good people, honestly, like most of us are really trying to do right by our clients as best we possibly can. If you can hold on to that date and modify some of what would have happened at that date. I think you can still have a spectacular celebration. So it's really about working with the people that you've secured to make sure that sort of what you're envisioning. Can be adjusted slightly and then fit this new model. And I think you'll still walk away. Extremely happy. And you don't have to necessarily postpone. So my hope is clients will take the ride with us and give us a shot to try to make something happen in 2021. So we can sort of inch our way back to some of the normalcy we all crave and desire. That's good, Greg, whether about you and any buses you want to throw anybody under heaven. No, I, you know, just in talking to, to the couples and I want to encourage them not to be discouraged. And, and, and I know, I mean, on one, hand it in, in Sean's great words about the glass being half full is. In in 20 years from now, when people find out you're not married in 2020 or 2021, they're going to be like, why. Wow. I mean, it's going to be a heck of a story to tell. And it's something that if, if, if you want to do it and, and. You know, have a heck of a fifth year. You know, five-year anniversary party or two or whatever sort of stuff. Just. Embrace it and just have it be the new you. The new, you know, the new normal. You know, and people are saying, or as Alan said, Maybe then you gotta wait until next year. But I think that you can do it. You know, and nothing is going to the courthouse, but if you decide to do a small one, Don't go to the courthouse. Get your same officiant. Get one of us, Sean at your, you. You're an efficient too, right? Yeah, we all, I mean, most DJs are and have a go grab your two best friends and go to your favorite. Whatever. Leg. You know, you'll someplace and go get married at sunset, you know? And, you know, I talked to a couple of the other day about, about doing that and I don't advertise that I do officiating. The only reason I have it is because I had an officiant not show up years and years ago. And so I do a few a year and everything, but how about go get married on a ferry? You know, Just the five-year maybe a photographer, maybe read, come shoot the video. How cool would that be? And just keep it there. Then you got that. And then you go have a party in 2022. That's good, Alan. I think that 20, a couple of couples who are listening to this podcast because they're engaged. Are in a crucible that. No other couples have had to face, you know, they've just the de the decisions and the challenges and the uncertainty. Are so much harder. For people in this timeframe. So I, you know, I feel for all of them, I think though that because of the circumstances, it's an opportunity for a couple to really, really examine what are their priorities? What do they want? Do they want more people? Do they want dancing? Can they live with smaller numbers? Do they have their heart set on a venue. You've got to communicate with your fiance. And just really in your heart to figure out what you would be happy with and then figure out how you might achieve that. You know, the, the other, the, the. For for me. And I think a lot of people in the industry in a lot of my couples, the uncertainty is the killer. If you said absolutely. We're we're not gonna have any dancing or we're not going to have more than 30 people at a wedding. Until this date, but then the state will be different. Then you can move, but nobody thought we'd be in a circumstance this bad right now. There's N. It's heartbreaking to think that the summer might continue on with all these restrictions, but it might. And so being realistic about that, keeping up on the latest from the governor's office. And I can give you all Greg cell phone number. You can check with him. Call me Mimi. So. I don't know. Good luck. That's what I've got to say. Yeah. Is it still eight six seven five three Oh nine. Did he, did he change it? Four to five. You know, I would encourage everybody to, if you search on Facebook for w S M E N, that's the Washington state. A wedding and event association. [unknown]. Yeah. Yeah. I'm sorry. I can't read Ws WEA and that's going to be having the latest information and we'll be able to help everybody out. Yeah. I'll think a diminisher and that's. Yeah, I mean, it's tough. I would say the couples that have done the small ones, you know, book me or someone else, the live streaming, I just. Whoever you book, but I tell you the ones that have done the 15 people in live stream debt. To grandma and grandpa, and then can move on with their lives and plan the party in a couple of years, I think is, are the ones that are. Cause otherwise you're just in this waiting game and it's tough and, and, and. You know, I get, I mean, everyone, everyone wants stuff and, you know, Everyone has expectations of everything in this world. And sometimes it is not the way that you wanted it to be. And you just. Got to figure it out, you know? So. Thank you guys all so much and I'll play that everyone's information and I'll plug that WSW thing in the show notes too, just to make it easy. Cause it's so buried in the show here, but yeah, I know a lot of people always post about, you know, where can we find the latest information and they really are doing. Where it's worked that way and keeping everything up to date.